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 Avatar-X
       
Alpha Husky
Location: West Coast
Gender: Male
yay!
 |  |  | Location Database Changes
< on 11/30/2004 5:03 PM >
|  | | | To protect UE locations, we're making changes to the Location Database.
First, the "Street Address" field has been removed from display, leaving only the City and Province.
Second, a new field has been added. "Real Name". It is only visible to the creator of the location and to moderators.
Third, The "Name" field has been changed to "Display Name". From now on, any locations which are sensitive (active, abandoned, under construction sites) will not be given a real name, but rather a vague fake name.
The moderators will know the real names, which will help prevent duplicate locations.
If the hospital in Windsor had been simply called "Abandoned Building" with no address information, it'd have been harder to find.
-av
huskies - such fluff. |
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andrea
 
Location: Baltimore MD
Gender: Female
Apparently, I am heinous.
| | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 1 on 11/30/2004 5:06 PM >
| | | | Sounds good, I hope you keep the DB cause I enjoy reading though and seeing pictures of places I can't visit and places my friend have visited.
This isn't boot camp and you are not a ninja. But you sure look like an idiot in that outfit.
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el nerdo
   
Chief UER Lackey
Gender: Male
What are you, from the Department of Know'm Sayin's? You takin' a Know'm census?
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 2 on 11/30/2004 5:08 PM >
| | | | What about pictures?
Should we have a ban on posting exterior shots of the buildings?
Exterior shots are just as dangerous as "real names"... local "bad guys" can conceivably make out where a location is by exterior shots: street signs, landmarks, even a picture of the building itself may lend some hints to the "bad guy": they may know of the building, but weren't aware of the fact it was easily accessable.
Interior shots should be okay, for the most part... exterior shots posted trump any attempt to mask the location of the building.
Av? Thoughts?
We really need to (as a group) engage in a serious discussion about this. EVERYONE needs to discuss this, as a community. Talking about it on the admin boards does a disservice to everyone else who may have a valid point/idea.
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Crossfire
Location: Kay-Dub
Gender: Male
Don't call it a comeback, I've been here for years.
| |  |  | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 3 on 11/30/2004 5:20 PM >
| | | | It's being discussed in both places. Any members can suggest and comment on it here, and those ideas will be distilled and final implementation will be discussed among the administration. Nobody's being shut out, however I think it makes total sense if the final changes to the LDB are dealt with behind closed doors, so to speak.
C.
Disgruntled. |
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el nerdo
Chief UER Lackey
Gender: Male
What are you, from the Department of Know'm Sayin's? You takin' a Know'm census?
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 4 on 11/30/2004 5:32 PM >
| | | | Posted by Crossfire
It's being discussed in both places. Any members can suggest and comment on it here, and those ideas will be distilled and final implementation will be discussed among the administration. Nobody's being shut out, however I think it makes total sense if the final changes to the LDB are dealt with behind closed doors, so to speak.
C.
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Well, I appreciate your candor on the matter, Crossfire.
But if that's really the case, why was the previous thread (http://www.uer.ca/...d=1&threadid=15480) locked? It came before this thread, and was an intelligent discussion.
While words mean lots, actions speak louder.
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Jester
Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male
Always just out of sight...
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 5 on 11/30/2004 5:44 PM >
|  | | | Posted by el nerdo
Well, I appreciate your candor on the matter, Crossfire.
But if that's really the case, why was the previous thread (http://www.uer.ca/...d=1&threadid=15480) locked? It came before this thread, and was an intelligent discussion.
While words mean lots, actions speak louder.
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Just seemed to me Avatar-X wanted to start the thread off about this subject on a fresh leg. I don't see this as censorship as you're allowed and encouraged to continue discussing the issue here... Kind of like "the meeting has been moved from room 101 to room 102, thanks"...
It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. |
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Roland
Location: Baltimore, MD
Gender: Male
Proud Leader of Brandishing a Firearm on the High Seas UE
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 6 on 11/30/2004 6:09 PM >
| | | | I also would not want to lose the LDB, mainly because I like looking at places I'll probably never get a chance to explore (like some of those asylums in Great Britain) and I also like to be able to share places that I enjoy exploring with people who, for whatever reason, probably won't ever get a chance to explore them.
Buildings have two natural enemies- water, and bears. |
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xrahy
Noble Donor
| | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 7 on 11/30/2004 6:18 PM >
| | | | Knock, knock....uh hello, is the AA meeting that was supposed to be in Room 102?
First, I have always appreciated and contributed to the Location Database and hope to be able to continue. It is one of the major things that make this forum stand out from the rest. I realize that having location information readily available in an easy to use format is going to make it possible for potential criminals to abuse these locations. A while ago this fear of attracting undo attention to the sites I posted caused me to change the names of the my locations to generic names. I've never included full street address for locations and in certain cases listed them as "undisclosed" giving only the state (province) name. I think making this change to all locations will be effective enough in providing some anonymity. Prohibiting exterior pictures would defeat the purpose of the LDB, using reasonable precaution when composing or editing the picture isn't a bad idea. i.e. removing street names and building numbers if necessary. While changes are being made, I would suggest removing the information of site security. It seems unnecessary and likely to change from time to time.
Anyway I just wanted express my support for the LDB, long live the LDB.
xrahy
Ps. Ramble ramble ramble....sorry.
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Billmac
Location: Scarborough
Gender: Male
well this ought to be different
| | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 8 on 11/30/2004 6:19 PM >
| | | | That does sound like a good idea after hearing about all the crap that's been going on, but could you still leave the locations of drain entrances?
I don't think there's much chances of vandals setting fire to a storm drain.
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Mark
Very Noble Donor
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
What is a lion, king of the savannah, when hes at the south pole?
| | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 9 on 11/30/2004 7:08 PM >
| | | | Maybe we can have a option to turn on street addresses. That would allow things like quarys, drains, public buildings that cant be vandalized (active and historical sites) to be traveled to, while concealing it.
Also I would still like to see the addresses for instance if someone is making a mini OPEX etc, it would be useful to know the address, but maybe only give them out to specific people at the descresion of the poster, or admin if the poster isnt around.
Sound fair?
PS outside shots should be allowed in my humble and small opinion.
"If the threat level goes up its probably because of me." "I am looking for a girl who enjoys headbutting beltbuckles" |
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DjMalign
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Gender: Male
Sexy, sexy, sexy
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 10 on 11/30/2004 7:51 PM >
|  | | | What about increasing the info for loyal donors? I'd be more than happy to become a donor in general, but it gives the LDB more money to work with as well as giving people more incentive to donate. Of course you'd have to screen the donors, but I think that bored criminals, which are probably in the minority here, will be less inclined to deal with donating and being screened rather than going out and finding something by themselves. Either way taking away from the LDB only hurts real UE-ers. I know that there are places I specifically want to explore after finding them on the LDB and if its as broad as "this unnamed location is somewhere in the state of texas" i'm shit out of luck.
I hate all of you |
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micro
Gender: Male
Slowly I turned
| | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 11 on 11/30/2004 7:54 PM >
| | | | The lack of even a general address is going to be highly annoying for people who have limited time when visiting other parts of the world. I really hope you're doing this because there's been a widespread problem of places getting trashed after being entered into the DB, and not just because of a few isolated incidents in Ontario.
I really think that the positive things that come out of the DB the way it exists now far outweigh any problems it might have caused or will cause in the future. Perhaps a bit more voluntary discretion is all that's needed, especially when it comes to the more pristine locations. If it's a place you feel is worth protecting, then you might want to be vague. If it's already smashed up and vandalized to hell (as most of the places that get added tend to be) then I don't really see a problem with being a bit more specific.
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Jester
Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male
Always just out of sight...
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 12 on 11/30/2004 7:57 PM >
| | | | Posted by micro
The lack of even a general address is going to be highly annoying for people who have limited time when visiting other parts of the world.
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Anyone visiting another area can very easily contact some local explorer. I've shown around all who have visited my turf, and from what I've seen, most other explorers are equally happy to help visiting explorers.
It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. |
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micro
Gender: Male
Slowly I turned
| | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 13 on 11/30/2004 8:09 PM >
| | | | But since we're in the process of establishing uptight rules like this, I can see fewer people volunteering information to strangers in the future. And while it's nice that you show visitors around, some of us prefer not to have a tour-guide around while exploring. It kinda takes the fun out of it, y'know?
I know these are probably moot points, but still..
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The Hitman's Daughter
Account Closed
Location: ottawa, canada
Gender: Female
hot pavement.
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 14 on 11/30/2004 8:26 PM >
| | | | In my opinion, the LDB is a database for people to show the places they've explored and share pictures, experiences, stories, and comments with each other. Not a "shopping list" of abandoned places for people to mooch off.
If anything I think this new method of running the LDB would encourage people to go find new UE sites for themselves instead of going "yo tell me where i can go 'splore some really kool shit kthanx bye" ..
richellesart.com
From now on and until the end of time, "Hip To Be Square" will conjure images of bloody bodies being hacked apart with axes.
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Frost
Location: K.Dot
Gender: Male
No beer makes Frosty go..something something..(Taz: Crrazzy?)..Dont mind if I doo!
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 15 on 11/30/2004 8:35 PM >
| | | | Posted by The Hitman's Daughter
In my opinion, the LDB is a database for people to show the places they've explored and share pictures, experiences, stories, and comments with each other. Not a "shopping list" of abandoned places for people to mooch off.
If anything I think this new method of running the LDB would encourage people to go find new UE sites for themselves instead of going "yo tell me where i can go 'splore some really kool shit kthanx bye" ..
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Exactly!
I mean christ, we're explorers people, go out there and find the locations, that's part of being an explorer... finding a location, investigating it's history as well as current status, scouting, planning, and executing a trip.
Shit, do some legwork. It may be nice to see all these pictures from all over the world, and hell don't get me wrong, I like looking at them too. But that can be easily placed on personal websites.
I think if we tighten up the policies on what information can be shown, then it would hopefully lessen some of the effects the LDB has on locations, not to mention it may bring the Law presence on the UE board down a bit....
I mean just a gallery of photos of places would be cool enough for me, I don't even care to know where the place is or what it's called, I just enjoy seeing the photos. I can think of a few UE sites set up in a manner where they only post select photos of locations or group several photos from different locations into one. It's fine that way, I still get to see the place, I still get to enjoy the photos, and no harm done. No shitheads to find it and go and bust the place up.
Why is marijuana not legal? Why is marijuana not legal? Its a natural plant that grows in the dirt. You know what's not natural, 80 year old dudes with hardons. Thats not natural, but we got pills for that. We're dedicating all our resources to keeping the old guys erect but we're puttin people in jail for smoking something that grows in the dirt. |
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Fubster
Location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida
Gender: Male
Though highly intelligent, guide dogs cannot interpret street signs.
| | | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 16 on 11/30/2004 8:42 PM >
| | | | Personally, I think that the LDB should stay. I also agree with the "no addresses" rule.
The main reason that I would like to keep the LDB is travel. After high school I plan on traveling a lot. If I saw a place in the LDB that looked interesting, I would go there. There's probably someone out there who does this now. If the LDB was gone, I could just ask people about locations, but it would be much simpler to keep the LDB.
Now, I'm sure there are a few bastards who come to this site to scope out vandalism spots, but the ratio of vandals to genuinely good people is probably wide in favor of the good ones. I really doubt that there is a vandal who is smart or sober enough to use a computer, find the LDB, and then travel to the site. This number will decrease if the LDB is made so that is a members-only feature. By the way, I don't really know the number of vandals-to UErs who view the LDB, I'm just making an assumption.
Perhaps there should be a karma system employed here, or a variation of the trusted star. If you have contributed to the UE community in a positive way, you get to view the LDB. That would probably put a halt to any lurkers. I doubt that the vast majority of vandals out there are so intent on viewing the LDB that he/she will deceive others to see it. It would be less of a hassle for them to just find places for themselves.
However, addresses and specific details about a site should be left out, just in case. As it has been pointed out, if you want the specific address, the person who submitted the location should provide it for you.
The LDB star/karma/trusted/whatever system would also help to stop people from submitting a location, and then disappearing, preventing the address to be given to anyone else. Even in that event, a good asking around or cruising around the town that the location is in in would work fine.
Just my opinion.
[last edit 11/30/2004 8:45 PM by Fubster - edited 1 times]
Sometimes, you need to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don't know what your rights are, or who it is you're talking to. Then, on your way out, slam the door. |
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Turd Furgusen
Location: Charleston, WV
Gender: Male
I think marijuana is just nature's way of saying high!
| | | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 17 on 11/30/2004 9:10 PM >
| | | | I think that it's a very good idea as long as everything is optional.
A lot of UE doesn't have to be trespassing, and a lot of UE sites are actually friendly to the public (just not infiltration). I know that Worcester State Hospital and Letchworth Village are friendly to people that want to walk dogs or just walk around. Weston State Hospital actually gives tours on a very limited basis during certain parts of the year. So sometimes it is useful and necessary to post the address or name. Also a lot of people here including myself are very interested in the history of these sites and the name is an important part of that.
As long as it is up to the creator of the site (or a mod if there is a good reason) to decide what information is pertinent and should be displayed I am all for this new option. Just don't censor us when it is not necessary and just for the sake of it "being a rule".
P.S. Are they going to delete all the pictures, postcards, or maps that have the names on them too? This could very easily get way out of hand and ruin the UEDB. Remember all this info. (name, address) was public the first place.
Everyone has a dark side, mines just a little more illuminated. |
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micro
Gender: Male
Slowly I turned
| | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 18 on 11/30/2004 9:16 PM >
| | | | Posted by Frost
I mean christ, we're explorers people, go out there and find the locations, that's part of being an explorer... finding a location, investigating it's history as well as current status, scouting, planning, and executing a trip.
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I agree with you entirely. That being said, I think we've all used the DB for a quick and dirty trip now and again, especially if we're in an area we're not familiar with and don't have time to do all the usual legwork. People should be able to use it for what they want with it though. If they want to use it just to look at the pictures then that's fine. If they want to use it as a "shopping list" then that's fine too. Each to their own. Me, I use it for a variety of different things while still taking the time to go out and do all the things you just mentioned.
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Jester
Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male
Always just out of sight...
| | | Re: Location Database Changes
<Reply # 19 on 11/30/2004 9:26 PM >
| | | | Posted by micro
I agree with you entirely. That being said, I think we've all used the DB for a quick and dirty trip now and again, especially if we're in an area we're not familiar with and don't have time to do all the usual legwork.
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Nope. Haven't done that.
Posted by micro
People should be able to use it for what they want with it though. If they want to use it just to look at the pictures then that's fine. If they want to use it as a "shopping list" then that's fine too.
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That makes it sound like it's their right to have all the benefits of other people's works. It's not a right, it's a priveledge, and a priveledge thats being abused.
It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. |
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