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1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9   UER Forum > Archived Old Forum Issues > Location Database Changes (Viewed 2721 times) The Hitman's Daughter  Account Closed Location: ottawa, canada Gender: Female hot pavement.  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 60 on 12/1/2004 1:40 PM >   Posted by xrahy Ohhhh..that's fucking brilliant. Will the fucktard moronic a-hole(s) who did this please stand up to recieve your beatdown award. yeah, SK said there was www.uer.ca graffiti at the last place he was at. lame. richellesart.com From now on and until the end of time, "Hip To Be Square" will conjure images of bloody bodies being hacked apart with axes. Duke  Noble Donor Location: Awww-shitby, Ontario Gender: Male Move it or lose it  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 61 on 12/1/2004 1:54 PM >   There are many arguments for and against the DB, but personally i think the benefits far outweigh the disadvantages. It's a way to amalgamate our stories and experiences so that we can all share and learn. Plus there are many places that I will never be able to visit, and without the DB i'd be missing some amazing images. Sure, some of the information is out there, but not all of it. I think the changes being made will go a good length to help keep the locations in it safe while allowing people to still stay up late at night going through the DB fantasizing about places they'll probably never go. (Keep in mind I don't say this without having already contributed a few locations myself)i mean really, for the places that are nowhere near me i don't really need to know a detailed location anyway. Ultimately, if we could googlebomb the search engines so that any searches for urban exploration won't turn up UER within the first 20 pages I think that may help keep the riff-raff out a wee bit and protect the DB, but ultimately the harder we make it for them to find us, the harder we make it for other explorers to find us. Contrary to popular belief, death isn't just for dead people. I know I was surprised too! It can happen to anybody! Horses, fiddler crabs, even a potato can die! - Tick Avatar-X  Alpha Husky Location: West Coast Gender: Male yay!  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 62 on 12/1/2004 2:07 PM >   - The site will not become a pay site, because I don't like pay sites. Considering the number of people who have donated vs the number who haven't, this would turn our membership to about 1% of it's current size. - The trusted star is useless. It's arbitrarily assigned, and unfair to have because we don't have moderators in every part of the world. You should be able to tell whether someone is trustworthy simply by speaking to them. - We are not going to ban people for vandalism or stealing. I will not force any ethics upon people. Sorry. - KAOS: If you think that this site could be replaced by a yahoo group, you clearly don't know anything about this site. - There is NO way we can "limit" who sees the DB in any kind of effective way. The problem isn't who sees the information, it's about the fact that the information is there to begin with. - I can't stop someone from writing "uer.ca" on a wall, but I wish they wouldn't. I think we're going to change the policy... I recommend that the new "Real Name" and "Display Name" be used only by location creators who feel their locations are sensitive, and not merely be blanket-applied to every location by the mods. All people should go and look at the locations they have created and decide if the place is sensitive, and if so, should change the Display Name to something more ambiguous. Had whoever posted the Windsor Hospital done this, it's entirely possible the same damage would have been done. But at least there would not have been the possibility that our site was to blame. So, to recap: - Privatizing the DB will NOT work. So stop talking about it. This includes any kind of method of identifying one member over another (trusted, etc) - The LDB will NOT be removed. Now let's all get back to our lives. huskies - such fluff. TurboZutek  King Dick Location: Scotland Gender: Male Giant octo-penised rapephant  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 63 on 12/1/2004 3:00 PM >   Posted by Avatar-X (see above post by av) HOLY SHIT! Av.... All of the above seems to me to be plain, no nonsense common sense. Respect. It seems to me what you are saying is: 'If you think you have a location that is a bit delicate, give it a false name' ?? Yeah ? If so... Couldn't agree more. Excellent. Chris... edit by av: you don't need to quote my whole post if it's right above this (trying to keep clutter down) [last edit 12/1/2004 3:27 PM by Avatar-X - edited 1 times] We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. IIVQ  Location: La Sud-Est du cité majeur du North-Holland (Bijlmer), .NL Gender: Male Back in Urbex!  |  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 64 on 12/1/2004 5:15 PM >   I agree with Octane and Turbo here. Sure there will be some sites which are vandalized as a direct cause of the LDB. How many? I personally think this number will be closer to 5 than to 10. To a total of 1662 sites that's not an awful lot. Off course sites gets trashed a week after people put them online. Now ask any statistician the relevance: probably not much, on the scale vandalizing happens. Sites get trashed all the time, actually that's the story of our life hobby. And as has been said: for me the exploring part is in the exploring of the building. I am willing to explore for an entrance, but not to drive around for 4 hours to find a site. I'd rather spend that time in visiting the site itself. So for some locations which are really great and you don't want anyone to know about: easy: don't post or post the location not as well-defined. But to make all locations undeterminable because some are in bad hoods, that's not a good thing to do. Now think how many sites are vandalized as a cause of the LDB and you'll see these are ridiculous measures. (or proof me otherwise that there are more than 10 UER.ca-LDB vandalized sites, with reasonable *proof*) Tijmen Posted by MapMan | 18/9/2005 19:25 | Hedy Lamarr made porn? Posted by turbozutek | 20/9/2005 2:29 | Dude, educate us! Jester  Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada Gender: Male Always just out of sight...  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 65 on 12/1/2004 5:27 PM >   Posted by IIVQ So for some locations which are really great and you don't want anyone to know about: easy: don't post or post the location not as well-defined. But to make all locations undeterminable because some are in bad hoods, that's not a good thing to do. Uhmm, Have you ever considered reading the posts before you reply ? Possibly the one by Av saying Posted by Avatar-X I recommend that the new "Real Name" and "Display Name" be used only by location creators who feel their locations are sensitive, and not merely be blanket-applied to every location by the mods. All people should go and look at the locations they have created and decide if the place is sensitive, and if so, should change the Display Name to something more ambiguous. Posted by IIVQ And as has been said: for me the exploring part is in the exploring of the building. I am willing to explore for an entrance, but not to drive around for 4 hours to find a site. I'd rather spend that time in visiting the site itself. Gotcha, it's totally cool for other people to spend tons of their time and effort to find a place as long as you don't have to. That's like saying, you plant the garden, work it, and harvest it, and i'll be happy to take the vegetables for nothing. Good to know. You should get back out what you put in. [last edit 12/1/2004 5:44 PM by Jester - edited 1 times] It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. Mike Dijital  UEDB Moderator Location: Boston MA. Gender: Male UE ver. 1.0  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 66 on 12/1/2004 5:40 PM >   I guess the big argument here, is , Which side of the LDB sword cuts less. Look as long as its up, someone somehow will abuse it, no matter how many restriction you put on it I see it like this The internet is full on info, the LDB is just a drop inthe bucket. take it down , its just one less website to get info from buuuuut think of it like this, your on the highway and just finished a candy bar, throw the wrapper out the window, there is plenty of trash on the road, one more piece isnt going to make a difference. RIGHT Wrong. THe LDB is GREAT untill its the reason for your way in getting boarded up. I have spoked with DCAM in my state. THe are the overseers of all the MASS asylums and state schools. I have spoken with the deputy director Ken Tilden quite a few times. I cant vouch for the rest of the US and canada, but in Mass, they do have a uer account, and they do read the LDB bi-weekly, to see whats going on. THATS ALL I NEED TO HEAR TO KNOW THE LDB IS A BAD THING. I will get off my soap box now EDIT , Av the thing about having the option to hide the name\\\Lets say I hide the name of a place, and some asshole , doesn't feel the name needs to be hidden and " unhides " the name. arnt we just back to square one, but with more hoops? [last edit 12/1/2004 6:11 PM by Mike Dijital - edited 3 times] www.deggi5.com / www.mikedijital.com IIVQ  Location: La Sud-Est du cité majeur du North-Holland (Bijlmer), .NL Gender: Male Back in Urbex!  |  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 67 on 12/1/2004 5:57 PM >   Posted by Jester Uhmm, Have you ever considered reading the posts before you reply ? Possibly the one by Av saying I started writing the reply even before av's post happened but I got caught up with other things. Gotcha, it's totally cool for other people to spend tons of their time and effort to find a place as long as you don't have to. That's like saying, you plant the garden, work it, and harvest it, and i'll be happy to take the vegetables for nothing. Good to know. You should get back out what you put in. Ok that's faulty logic. The products of your garden are one-time use, the LDB simply points to stuff that does perishes, so maybe as many people should pick the fruits of it before it does. You don't lose anything by giving out it's location. And in return: Uhmm, Have you ever considered reading the posts before you reply? I remember myself saying: Posted by IIVQ So for some locations which are really great and you don't want anyone to know about: easy: don't post or post the location not as well-defined. But to make all locations undeterminable because some are in bad hoods, that's not a good thing to do. I'm not asking you to share more information than you already do, I ask not to hide any information I want to share. Tijmen [last edit 12/1/2004 5:59 PM by IIVQ - edited 1 times] Posted by MapMan | 18/9/2005 19:25 | Hedy Lamarr made porn? Posted by turbozutek | 20/9/2005 2:29 | Dude, educate us! el nerdo  Chief UER Lackey Gender: Male What are you, from the Department of Know'm Sayin's? You takin' a Know'm census?  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 68 on 12/1/2004 6:09 PM >   Posted by IIVQ You don't lose anything by giving out it's location. Funny, there's a hospital in Windsor that begs to differ. NoSuchPerson  Stop, or I'll ask you again!  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 69 on 12/1/2004 6:16 PM >   Av. The trusted star was a good idea that was removed for no practical reason. If someone lives in a remote part of the world, well, I guess they'd have to try that much harder to get it. I know several people in Europe for example, that I've never met, but trust enough to give a star to. Secondly, banning somebody for posting something that they vandalized or stole isn't forcing ethics on someone, it's forcing the rules of the board on them. How would you like a visit from Toronto Police arresting you for aiding and abetting a criminal offence by making information easily available to them. That's the reality of the situation, and it could VERY realistically happen. To answer what you're probably going to post about this - yes it is legal, it does happen, and it can happen. I'm not saying remove the LDB completly, but something HAS to happen. It can't be something half-assed like hiding the real name or something. People that can view the LDB should be people who are trusted and established members on here who have proven themselves to not be vandals, etc... That's exactly why the trusted star was introduced in the first place. But, having said that - it IS your board and you're free to do whatever you wish, but just keep in mind that unless you do something, people are going to stop posting al together once people start getting busted based on no more than the fact that security/police recognize their face/name...that's already started to happen, hasn't it? -Ex Unit calling radio say again? Fubster  Location: Tampa Bay Area, Florida Gender: Male Though highly intelligent, guide dogs cannot interpret street signs.  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 70 on 12/1/2004 6:21 PM >   Posted by Avatar-X - The trusted star is useless. It's arbitrarily assigned, and unfair to have because we don't have moderators in every part of the world. You should be able to tell whether someone is trustworthy simply by speaking to them. When this star is assigned arbitrarily, it does become useless. If the only way you can earn the trusted star is by meeting an already trusted person, it becomes exclusive, and restrictive. I agree with you. You can make a relatively accurate assessment of someone based on what they say and contribute. For instance, if someone has donated their time or money to this site, you have good reason to deem him/her trustworthy. If someone posts here regularly, and contributes worthwhile information and constructive criticism, it's a fair bet that they are trustworthy. On the other hand, if someone comes here, and acts like Dr. Laura Schlessinger on meth, and contributes nothing positive, you have no reason to trust them. The trusted star could be assigned my mods, or by others with the star, or maybe by a vote, or something. The star could be revoked my mods if there is a good reason. As I said, this star could also be used to restrict information given in the LDB. It might work well on paper, but not in practise, I don't know. I just think it's at least worth a shot. Posted by IIVQ Ok that's faulty logic. The products of your garden are one-time use, the LDB simply points to stuff that does perishes, so maybe as many people should pick the fruits of it before it does. We should focus more on preserving a site than trying to explore it as much as possible before it falls victim to society. [last edit 12/1/2004 6:25 PM by Fubster - edited 1 times] Sometimes, you need to march right in and demand your rights, even if you don't know what your rights are, or who it is you're talking to. Then, on your way out, slam the door. TurboZutek  King Dick Location: Scotland Gender: Male Giant octo-penised rapephant  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 71 on 12/1/2004 6:21 PM >   Jester, as someone who doesn't use the LDB* and so perhaps does not fully understand WHY people use it and like it I'll explain: For me, YES it IS totally cool for me to spend time and effort for others to make use of it. When I'm standing out in a cold night with the rain coming down waiting for my long exposure to finish... Why am I doing it ? To hoard the photo to myself and think 'hey, am I COOOL or WHAT?' or... To give something to others ? A bit of help, a bit of knowledge and a good laugh. It's why I go out and do it - to share with others. You see these magnificent old buildings everywhere in the UK - and do people know what's inside ? No.. They don't! Will they look ? No, they might not be brave enough, have the time, could be in a wheelchair etc etc etc So I'll give them that experience - free of charge. Those of us who don't want to give out their precious information that they spent so much of their valuable time researching - don't. Post some pics and give the place a generic name... Or - choose your' own prefered route and don't use the LDB at all. But no need to rape it for everyone simply because you cannot understand the pro-LDB point of view. But as Av has already pointed out the changes proposed are optional and don't constitute a complete erosion of the LDB then this is all fairly academic. Chris.... *And that is not a snide remark, just an observation. Posted by Jester Gotcha, it's totally cool for other people to spend tons of their time and effort to find a place as long as you don't have to. That's like saying, you plant the garden, work it, and harvest it, and i'll be happy to take the vegetables for nothing. Good to know. You should get back out what you put in. We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. TurboZutek  King Dick Location: Scotland Gender: Male Giant octo-penised rapephant  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 72 on 12/1/2004 6:23 PM >   Also... I'm not sure on the legal situation in Canada / the US... But AIDING AND ABETTING A CRIMINAL ACT by posting a PUBLICLY available address ?? Come on. Chris... We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. Jester  Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada Gender: Male Always just out of sight...  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 73 on 12/1/2004 6:28 PM >   Posted by IIVQ You don't lose anything by giving out it's location. And in return: Uhmm, Have you ever considered reading the posts before you reply? Your post had complained against blanket solutioning all places with false/vague names, when Avatar-X had already said that was not going to happen. If we can blame that on Av's post appearing while you were writing, fine. Otherwise, you were bemoaning something that had just been stated as something that wouldn't be done. As for places not losing anything by being completely open on the LDB, there's plenty of places that have suffered for it, so there is loss because of it. And just my opinion, anyone that would prefer to shop for explorations from the LDB rather than actually discover something themselves, just doesn't sound like an explorer, they sound like a tourist. UE isn't a trip to an amusement park. "ooooh, we'll go on the whitby psyche tour at 4, and then the security jamboree at Hearns at 9, I hope they have refreshments available." Turbo. I fully understand the LDB, which is specifically why I don't use it. Sometimes sacrifices must be made for the greater good. This is one of those times. It's not going to stop anybody from looking at the pictures, it just means they can't just stroll down to any particular place now. Anyone that wants to see a place they viewed in the LDB is perfectly welcome to message the creator of the location, and ask for more info. Does this hurt the ldb or community ? If anything it will get more explorers communicating with one another directly, maybe forging bonds that span the globe. Doesn't seem detrimental in that regard. [last edit 12/1/2004 6:37 PM by Jester - edited 1 times] It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. NoSuchPerson  Stop, or I'll ask you again!  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 74 on 12/1/2004 6:46 PM >   Posted by turbozutek Also... I'm not sure on the legal situation in Canada / the US... But AIDING AND ABETTING A CRIMINAL ACT by posting a PUBLICLY available address ?? Come on. Chris... Well, you'd think so wouldn't you. My college recently got it's ass dragged through court by Microsoft and ended up getting sued for a pretty heafty chunk of change. Why? Not because THEY pirated software, but because a laptop that was the personal property of one of the students was connected via wireless, and was pirating Microsoft software, when MS auditers happened to be in the school (the school is/was a Microsoft Partner, so they do these audits from time to time). It's absolutely stupid and absurd that somebody who realistically has no control over what gets sent over the network can be held accountable for the traffic, but that's the way it is. Same situation here. Let's say a property owner with enough money to attract a good lawyer got pissed off at his site being on here. He could EASILY have his lawyers flex some muscle and find out who owns the site and who hosts it. It wouldn't take much for him to then go after them, either criminally or, most likely, civilly for damages and such. Yet another example that's somewhat related. In the Niagara Region, there's a jail. In the parking lot of the jail was a vehicle belonging to a weekend inmate serving an intermittant sentence. Well, somebody attempted to break out of the prison by having someone on the outside prop the ladder up to the fence. Guess what. The owner of the van was arrested for aiding and abetting an escape. Get this. Not the driver, but the OWNER. It was a commercial vehicle. So, given what lawyers can do with words, I wouldn't at all be suprised of something like that were to happen. I'm not saying it's right, and I'm not saying it wouldn't get dropped in court, but it could still happen. That's the thing a *lot* of people don't realize. The police can arrest you for ANYTHING THEY WANT. Just because you might not have actually DONE it doesn't stop them from arresting you on it. A cop could arrest you for murder...doesn't mean you did it. Sure, he'd get fired/charged for false arrest, but it doesn't change the fact that, given sufficient proof/belief, they can make your life a living hell. I don't have to tell you guys about the couple of horror stories that have happened to people on here in the past for doing nothing at all. -Ex Unit calling radio say again? TurboZutek  King Dick Location: Scotland Gender: Male Giant octo-penised rapephant  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 75 on 12/1/2004 6:48 PM >   Posted by Jester Turbo. I fully understand the LDB, which is specifically why I don't use it. Sometimes sacrifices must be made for the greater good. This is one of those times. It's not going to stop anybody from looking at the pictures, it just means they can't just stroll down to any particular place now. Anyone that wants to see a place they viewed in the LDB is perfectly welcome to message the creator of the location, and ask for more info. Does this hurt the ldb or community ? If anything it will get more explorers communicating with one another directly, maybe forging bonds that span the globe. Doesn't seem detrimental in that regard. Well, I can almost see your point. Hiding the address is not my primary concern anyways - it's 'closed hospital' 'old dog house' and all kinds of retarded arbitry names that mean nothing. However as I understand the proposal this shouldn't be a problem as anonymous names are optional.... ? I just hope this new age of LDB paranoia that seems to be encroaching on us doesn't put people off posting links, comments, pictures and making small talk and having a laugh at my locations. I have already forged strong bonds with many, many people around the globe thanks to the LDB - I have more offers of 'stay with me for a few days if you are in xxxx city' than I have ever had in my life. I've got people wanting to meet me, fly me places and hell I've even got an OPEX to arrange in Scotland next year. ALL of this excellent work could not have been achieved without the LDB being a largely unmoderated and non-paranoid place to talk and laugh. I hope it remains that way no matter the changes proposed. Chris... We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. TurboZutek  King Dick Location: Scotland Gender: Male Giant octo-penised rapephant  |  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 76 on 12/1/2004 6:57 PM >   Posted by ExKa|iBuR Well, you'd think so wouldn't you. My college recently got it's ass dragged through court by Microsoft and ended up getting sued for a pretty heafty chunk of change. Why? Not because THEY pirated software, but because a laptop that was the personal property of one of the students was connected via wireless, and was pirating Microsoft software, when MS auditers happened to be in the school (the school is/was a Microsoft Partner, so they do these audits from time to time). It's absolutely stupid and absurd that somebody who realistically has no control over what gets sent over the network can be held accountable for the traffic, but that's the way it is. So, given what lawyers can do with words, I wouldn't at all be suprised of something like that were to happen. I'm not saying it's right, and I'm not saying it wouldn't get dropped in court, but it could still happen. That's the thing a *lot* of people don't realize. The police can arrest you for ANYTHING THEY WANT. Just because you might not have actually DONE it doesn't stop them from arresting you on it. A cop could arrest you for murder...doesn't mean you did it. Sure, he'd get fired/charged for false arrest, but it doesn't change the fact that, given sufficient proof/belief, they can make your life a living hell. I don't have to tell you guys about the couple of horror stories that have happened to people on here in the past for doing nothing at all. -Ex You seem to know of which you speak Ex, so I'll take your advice as read matey. I'm not used to the somewhat bizarre and Paranoid legal systems of the US or Canada (To a lesser extent) - or the huge implications of everyone launching civil actions against each other. Hell, UE isn't even a criminal or civil offence where I'm at. However, my 'common sense' approach to this would be that if Av is concerned, consult a lawyer ? Chris... We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. NoSuchPerson  Stop, or I'll ask you again!  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 77 on 12/1/2004 7:02 PM >   Naw, I wouldn't waste money on a lawyer. Practically speaking...would any of that ever happen? Naw. He might get some threatening e-mails, but that's probably about as far as it would ever go. I was just posting a "This is what could happen, worst case" kinda thing, but I think it's something we should keep in the back of our heads. This is why I'm fully supportive of restricting LDB access. Personally, I would not post a location that I recently found for a few reasons. One, because I wouldn't want to see it sealed up or vandalized, but mostly, I wouldn't want to expose myself to some kind of trouble. I don't know if this option exsists, but can you post a location and pictures without your name associated to it? -Ex Unit calling radio say again? Haunting_1963  Location: Edmonton AB Gender: Male  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 78 on 12/1/2004 8:19 PM >   Friends, First i'd like to say I believe what happened to the hospital in Windsor would have happened sooner or later regardless of its posting on UER. I did not locate a copy of Saturday's paper unfortunately, I've been extremely busy lately. I however will reaffirm what I said about posting sensitive sites on the LDB. I'm not blaming anyone, in fact I received a PM about the hospital being removed from the LDB before the article in the paper appeared, and for all I know before the "incident" in the hospital even took place. This was a very responsible and wise thing to do. As a loose knit "community" we are facing many problems. We have all seen what happens to a movement when it goes mainstream. The Punk movement, the Goth movement, even fashion tends to die when its appeal becomes to broad. Lately I have been noticing more and more newspaper articles and movies, T.V series, etc featuring UE'ers. This is inevitable and unstoppable, and its presentation to the public is bound to grow. If I was a reporter with a deadline who needed a story, I would most likely write one about ue'ing. Its easy, fast and has broad appeal. When I became aware of this as a hobby, not just something I was always interested in, it was because I was looking for pictures of Michigan Central Station. I see it all the time and was wondering what it was. Eventually, my search led me here. The key to this is that I was seeking out the hobby. When people are introduced to the hobby not by a personal search but have it introduced to them through an article in a paper or a television special, it becomes difficult to discern between who really wants "in" and who's looking for something to trash. I realise that there are exceptions and it is a bit of a stretch but it is how I feel. We cannot combat the broad appeal of the hobby as it is introduced to a growing number of people, and the LDB issue is a symptom of the growth of the community. In my view there is only one way to police ourselves and try to keep the vandals and arsonists out. That is through a distributed trusted tier system. Sounds complicated? Yes, let me elaborate. We use the LDB as it sits now as level 1. It is pointless to modify the current LDB as any damage has most likely already been done. It will still be possible to post to the current LDB as it sits, and to view it, rate it, etc. If a new member or old member should decide to post a discovery, or add pictures to an existing site, and the place is well known in his domicile he will be able to submit it to tier 1. This tier would contain current entries and new entries deemed public knowledge. However, should he discover something sensitive and wish to share, but not with the general populus, he may at his option submit to tier 2. This tier will contain sensitive entries. Access to tier 2 entries will be gained through time spent in the forum, being sponsored by an existing member of tier 2, a donation, being an active participant in the LDB (E.G adding entries, etc.) or through a petition for entry submitted to a separate forum for debate on that persons merit. We cannot control the actions of others, only ourselves. Therefore we can only try to mitigate the damage that any forum or LDB entry can cause. I believe that simply putting a hurdle to access the most pristine locations will be enough of a deterrent to keep most undesirables out, while allowing us to share and keeping enthusiastic new members appetites sated with new entries in the general LDB. It should not be too difficult to discern between who is here for the hobby and who is not. I personally enjoy sharing my limited finds with members of this forum. I also would encourage those who live in a community to create a separate forum for those who live in your area to meet, discuss, and socialize. Using the example of Windsor, those in my area could co-operate in suggesting which entries should be submitted to tier 1, and which to tier 2. Of course, there will be those who do not wish to discuss their entries with others. We trust Avatar and his assistants with personal information already, whether it be an email address or phone number it is not at all difficult for the police to track us down. An I.P address is normally sufficient to find you. Therefore I submit that we trust his judgement in disputes on which tier an entry should find home in. If 1 person submits an entry to tier 2, and another comes and submits an identical site to tier 1, Av or an appointee will decide which tier an item will go in. Normally it should not be difficult to see which tier an entry belongs too. If over time this system would prove effective, perhaps more active people would be encouraged to share location data with those who are trusted, if need be. In closing I feel that although many sensitive entries are openly displayed on other websites, at least with this type of plan we could ensure it is not "our" website. At the same time, if effective, we could maintain an archive of sites people are unlikely to share otherwise while maintaining their integrity. We are missing out on many great finds because of the security issue, and at the very least this type of a solution may buy us a little time. Regards, 63 Have Flashlight Will Travel. Avatar-X  Alpha Husky Location: West Coast Gender: Male yay!  |  |  Re: Location Database Changes <Reply # 79 on 12/1/2004 8:23 PM >   I feel like most of the people that replied since I wrote my last post haven't read it. Colonel Fubster: The trusted star WILL NOT WORK. It was tried for a year or so, and IT DOES NOT WORK. I repeat again: Trying to restrict information to the right people WILL NOT WORK. You'll NEVER EVER EVER have a system that allows "good" people in while keeping "bad" people out that's 100% foolproof. And if you think that the police/vandals wouldn't donate $5 to find the location of their next rave, you've got another think coming. Exkalibur: I'm not worried about legal ramifications. I am NOT going to push a single set of ethics upon everyone. PLEASE stop talking about ethics now, this is not an ethics discussion. huskies - such fluff. UER Forum > Archived Old Forum Issues > Location Database Changes (Viewed 2721 times)  1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9   All content and images copyright © 2002-2024 UER.CA and respective creators. Graphical Design by Crossfire. 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