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Posted by splumer
Blame him? No, I don't blame him, but to say he bears NO responsibility isn't true either. I look at it as a shouting fire in a crowded theater situation.
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That isn't really accurate. The person who shouts fire in a crowded theater exposes others to the direct threat of physical harm. People reacting to the perceived threat may panic and harm others in their haste to escape harm themselves. Their intentions are likely not malicious and the damage inflicted not intentional, only motivated by a very real desire to survive. Here we have a clear, reasonable line of blame back to the person that started the chain of events that can safely exclude the persons that physically caused the damage from responsibility.
Person "A" started the panic by lying about a physically threatening situation
Persons "B" through "M" responded by attempting to prevent their own deaths
Person "N" died as a result of their actions
Person "A" is responsable
What happened in this case is
Person "A" committed an offensive, but basically harmless act
Person "B" told his friends about it some time later
Persons "C" through "M" became offended and decided to exact revenge for the offence on people that reminded them of person "A"
Person "N" died as a result of their actions
Persons "C" through "N" are responsible
The questions are-Is there an immediate threat? Are the actions a reasonable response to that threat? Was the damage a direct result of an attempt to protect themselves from the threat?
In the movie theater example used most often-yes, yes, and yes.
In the case of the UN worker deaths-no, no, and no.
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If everyone told you that by yelling fire in crowded theater people would die, would you still do it? This isnt a child that we are telling, don't touch the stove you will get burned, then they do it anyway and they learn their mistake. This man was told by several world figures that if he did this people would die, yet he did it anyway fully aware of what the outcome would be. He is just as bad as they are.
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You're still misdirecting, stop it.
The shouting fire in a theater anology is faulty.
The question aught be:
Why does the Islamic faith allow such barbaric violence?
Why is this tolerated?
If one makes funny cartoons mocking Jesus or Moses, Xtians and Jews don't run around rioting and beheading people.
Make fun of Buddha and ... where are the riots in China?
Come on people, this is insanity.
Science flies you to the Moon. Religion flies you into tall buildings. |
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Posted by DevilC
The question aught be:
Why does the Islamic faith allow such barbaric violence?
Why is this tolerated?
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Exactly!
https://abandonedo...bout/the-aok-team/ |
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Posted by DevilC
You're still misdirecting, stop it.
The shouting fire in a theater anology is faulty.
The question aught be:
Why does the Islamic faith allow such barbaric violence?
Why is this tolerated?
If one makes funny cartoons mocking Jesus or Moses, Xtians and Jews don't run around rioting and beheading people.
Make fun of Buddha and ... where are the riots in China?
Come on people, this is insanity.
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Islam doesn't support it. The people who did this are radicals. Do Christians support the killing of abortion doctors? No, but there are people who claim to do it for god. Al Qaeda is not representative of Islam just like westboro baptist isn't for Christians, to assume so is narrow minded. How many Muslims have rioted here, in Indonesia, Iran, Iraq, saudi arabi, etc etc. If Islam supported such behavior wouldn't there be widespread rioting instead of a couple of isolated incidents?
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False.
There was and has been wide-spread rioting.
Have you read the Koran?
If not, stop posting here.
Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby
Islam doesn't support it. The people who did this are radicals. |
Science flies you to the Moon. Religion flies you into tall buildings. |
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Posted by DevilC
False.
There was and has been wide-spread rioting.
Have you read the Koran?
If not, stop posting here.
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Yes I have, I have a copy of it right next to a copy of the bible. Are you anything more than a hateful bigot? If not, stop posting here.
I also have the book I linked to earlier. The riots have only happened in two afghani cities. There is a difference between protest and riot. Perhaps you should get more educated before you keep posting moronic bullshit.
http://www.msnbc.m..._and_central_asia/
[last edit 4/7/2011 12:34 PM by MonkeyPunchBaby - edited 1 times]
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Your 2 minutes of internet research yielded ... 
Straight to the name calling and ad-hominem.
UER desperately needs more internet tough guys.
Keep it classy.
Science flies you to the Moon. Religion flies you into tall buildings. |
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Posted by DevilC
Your 2 minutes of internet research yielded ...
Straight to the name calling and ad-hominem.
UER desperately needs more internet tough guys.
Keep it classy.
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It only takes two minutes to find current world issue articles. And everything you had said makes you look like a bigot. Have you ever seen a Quran? You have have been incredibly bigoted and hatful and portly educated on everything when it comes to Islam. I find you ignorance highly annoying and insulting. I am far from an internet tough guy. If someone pointing out you are wrong on everything and you running out of things to say is viewed as an attack on you, then by all means it was.
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Research FAIL.
Stick to pr0n.
20 dead in response to events 1/2 a world away?
No big deal?
Who is the bigot kid? It ain't me.
Spend several minutes looking ... you'll come up with riots and vitriol the Islamic world over.
“Enraged over the burning of a Koran in Florida … Muslims have murdered about 20 people in Afghanistan and five in Pakistan—none of whom ever burned a Koran or had any acquaintance with the men who did.”
Nigeria:
"Muslim mob storms three Christian villages, murders at least two people over alleged Qur'an desecration."
http://allafrica.c.../201104040856.html
Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby
The riots have only happened in two afghani cities. There is a difference between protest and riot. Perhaps you should get more educated before you keep posting moronic bullshit.
http://www.msnbc.m..._and_central_asia/
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Because you have a flawed world view and a sadly naaive concept of one of the Islamic faith.
That's cool though.
You are in good company.
Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby
And everything you had said makes you look like a bigot.
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[last edit 4/7/2011 12:57 PM by DevilC - edited 1 times]
Science flies you to the Moon. Religion flies you into tall buildings. |
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Posted by DevilC
Research FAIL.
Stick to pr0n.
20 dead in response to events 1/2 a world away?
No big deal?
Who is the bigot kid? It ain't me.
Spend several minutes looking ... you'll come up with riots and vitriol the Islamic world over.
“Enraged over the burning of a Koran in Florida … Muslims have murdered about 20 people in Afghanistan and five in Pakistan—none of whom ever burned a Koran or had any acquaintance with the men who did.”
Nigeria:
"Muslim mob storms three Christian villages, murders at least two people over alleged Qur'an desecration."
http://allafrica.c.../201104040856.html
Because you have a flawed world view and a sadly naaive concept of one of the Islamic faith.
That's cool though.
You are in good company.
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The article from Africa is unrelated to this event.
Spend several minutes looking and you can find just as much vitriol from christians.
you are still the bigot because you are lumping millions of people into one group based on the actions of a few extremist.
Where is this article regarding people in pakistan being killed?
I don't have a flawed view of the world. I'm just not a hateful bigot that hates people of different religions.
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Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby
I'm just not a hateful bigot that hates people of different religions.
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Anyone who conflicts your flawless beliefs is a hateful bigot.
Stop this name calling.
https://abandonedo...bout/the-aok-team/ |
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Posted by Mr_Fiend
Anyone who conflicts your flawless beliefs is a hateful bigot.
Stop this name calling.
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someone who says that an entire group of people deserve to have their holy book desecrated and says
Posted by DevilC
Why does the Islamic faith allow such barbaric violence?
Why is this tolerated?
If one makes funny cartoons mocking Jesus or Moses, Xtians and Jews don't run around rioting and beheading people.
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sounds fairly bigoted to me. if you two can't even process the idea that not all muslims are evil, then perhaps you two need to do more research in your own faith and in other faiths.
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1 - Yes it is.
2 - Yes you do.
3 - Yes you are ... and you cannot formulate logical arguments, see fallacy when it slaps you in the face, nor adhere to basic premises of rational convesation. But again, this is the intern3t - you are in good company kid.
You say that a pastor in Florida burning a Koran provokes MANY murders in Afghanistan/Pakistan, Africa, and Indonesia ... is akin to saying that a woman wearing working the streets in Miama Florida (dressed provocatively in an UN-Islamic fashion) provokes dozens of rapes in Afghanistan ... and she should feel remorse.
It is normal to react to offensive behavior with anger.
It is not normal to react to offensive behavior with violence, especially mass violence toward people who have no relation to the person who offended you.
That is only normal behavior to sociopaths, and “they were asking for it” is an enabling lie that only benefits said sociopaths.
Stop enabling a culture of psychopaths.
Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby
The article from Africa is unrelated to this event.
I don't have a flawed view of the world.
I'm just not a hateful bigot that hates people of different religions.
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Science flies you to the Moon. Religion flies you into tall buildings. |
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Posted by DevilC
1 - Yes it is.
2 - Yes you do.
3 - Yes you are ... and you cannot formulate logical arguments, see fallacy when it slaps you in the face, nor adhere to basic premises of rational convesation. But again, this is the intern3t - you are in good company kid.
You say that a pastor in Florida burning a Koran provokes MANY murders in Afghanistan/Pakistan, Africa, and Indonesia ... is akin to saying that a woman wearing working the streets in Miama Florida (dressed provocatively in an UN-Islamic fashion) provokes dozens of rapes in Afghanistan ... and she should feel remorse.
It is normal to react to offensive behavior with anger.
It is not normal to react to offensive behavior with violence, especially mass violence toward people who have no relation to the person who offended you.
That is only normal behavior to sociopaths, and “they were asking for it” is an enabling lie that only benefits said sociopaths.
Stop enabling a culture of psychopaths.
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The fuck are you talking about? seriously can you stick to one topic? i pointed that a guy burning teh holy book of a faith is wrong, and is responsible for what happened. what happened is horrible, i never said it wasnt. The man did this to attack and degrade the entire islamic faith. you make you own assumptions about what i am saying and you are very far off. the guy in FL knew what would happen if he did, yet he carried on.
there is a chance that if you shoot someone in the head with a gun they won't die, but it is very likely they will die. doctors and surgeons tell me if i shoot someone in teh head they will die. I shoot them any way, and they die. Its not my fault they died right?
or i have a match and i'm standing next to someone covered in gas. i light the match and throw it on them. i was just trying to get rid of the gas not teh person, yet they burned to death. again not my fault, right?
thats how your logic is working right? the people on 9/11 just attacked new york city and DC, so why is the rest of the nation in a war? why did we go at all? they were just making a point right? even though they knew folks would die, its not their fault they died.
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Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby
if you two can't even process the idea that not all muslims are evil |
If not all then most are evil. That's what you just said by the phrase "not ALL muslims are evil".
Hell, even the MEDIA is starting to expose islam for what it is. I don't see why you have to defend islam so much, but you wont lift a finger for christianity. Which really doesnt make sense since you believe they are so equal.
I really dont care what you believe in, but you just dont make sense.
https://abandonedo...bout/the-aok-team/ |
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Posted by Mr_Fiend
If not all then most are evil. That's what you just said by the phrase "not ALL muslims are evil".
Hell, even the MEDIA is starting to expose islam for what it is. I don't see why you have to defend islam so much, but you wont lift a finger for christianity. Which really doesnt make sense since you believe they are so equal.
I really dont care what you believe in, but you just dont make sense.
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i defend Christianity, go to the to creationism thread on here if you need examples. i support accurate representation of religions, not stereotypes. i will call all religions out on their bullshit. no religion supports hate or violence towards anyone or anything. be it against homosexuals or other religions or races.
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So Monkey, if I see a protester burning the American Flag on TV that guy in your mind is just as bad as me if I were to go out and kill a bunch of people that I vaguely associate with the guy burning the flag?
Or if I google "muslim burn bible" and find, oh say this image of a burned Bible.
Then I would be understandable of me to shoot a few random Muslims coming out of a local mosque because I was so mad about it. Those guys in the picture are just as guilty as me.
Or next time I see a picture of "Piss Christ" I can go and set fire to the Philadelphia Art Museum and we can lock me up, but don't forget to get Andres Serrano and throw him in jail with me. I mean if he instigated me then he is just as guilty, and it would be more his fault more really, if he never made me mad it would never happen.
Thats what you are telling me Monkey.
[last edit 4/7/2011 1:51 PM by Soldat - edited 1 times]
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Im saying this guy in FL didnt just burn a Quran, he did it out of hate and with a dozen world leaders telling him what would happen if he did. He knew the risk going into it. He knew the reaction and yet he did it. That is premeditated.
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I read that Kooky-Kaddafi razed a mosque because it was somehow affiliated with rebels.
I wonder if the good Muslims of Afghanistan will riot and kill a few Arabs (country of origin doesn't seem to matter) to show that no one messes with Islam.
You stopped making sense a while ago kid. [/b
]Why so angry?
In this post, you underscore my valid and correct point below:
Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby
i pointed that a guy burning teh holy book of a faith is wrong, and is responsible for what happened. what happened is horrible, i never said it wasnt. The man did this to attack and degrade the entire islamic faith. you make you own assumptions about what i am saying and you are very far off. the guy in FL knew what would happen if he did, yet he carried on. |
Posted by DevilC
It is normal to react to offensive behavior with anger.
It is not normal to react to offensive behavior with violence, especially mass violence toward people who have no relation to the person who offended you.
That is only normal behavior to sociopaths, and “they were asking for it” is an enabling lie that only benefits said sociopaths.
Stop enabling a culture of psychopaths.
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[last edit 4/7/2011 1:53 PM by DevilC - edited 1 times]
Science flies you to the Moon. Religion flies you into tall buildings. |
Ethics
