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 NoSuchPerson
      
Stop, or I'll ask you again!
 |  | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 40 on 7/25/2004 9:44 PM >
|  | | | Honestly, Law Enforcement both in the United States and Canada need to chill the fuck out.
This attitude of "Guilty until proven innocent" goes against everything our countries stand for. By even introducing the Patriot Act, it's almost as though the government is watching you, expecting that you're up to no good.
I had a Toronto Police officer suspended for 10 days without pay for something similar to this once. He harassed the heck out of me, threatened to arrest me, etc... Well, I went to the Police Services Board, needless to say, I had a very big grin on my face when I went to his hearing..it was the closest I could come to saying "Fuck you pig" without getting arrested 
I do agree though. Even today, the government is still in "scared" mode, so anybody and everybody is suspect. Sad, but that's the way things are I guess.
Kinda makes you wonder if the terrorists infact, won.
-Ex
Unit calling radio say again? |
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Indigenous Insurgent
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Gender: Male
Only the Truth is revolutionary
| |  |  | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 41 on 7/26/2004 4:06 AM >
| | | | I have no problem with a cop walking up to me and asking why I'm taking pictures of something. I take no offense at simply being asked and it's kinda nice to see them being vigilant. It's when I run into the "I think you're a vandal/thief/terrorist and you're going to be treated like one until you can prove otherwise" attitude that really pisses me off.
I'm not one of those people who cries harrassment everytime a cop looks at me, but I am one of the few who is aware of my rights and expects a certain level of professionalism from police. Here are a couple examples of run-ins I've had with the police...
Good Example:
I was riding around downtown on my bike late one evening and I noticed that the moon was especially big and bright. Riding around until I found a good spot, I hopped off my bike and took out my camera to snap some pics. I was futzing around with different camera settings when a cop pulled up next to me, and asked why I was taking pictures of the bridge. I stared at him blankly for a second before it clicked that there was a bridge directly underneath the moon. I explained that I wasn't concerned with the bridge at all and was taking pictures of the moon.
He glanced up and remarked that he hadn't even noticed how bright the moon was that night. He then pulled away after saying he hoped my photos turned out well.
Bad Example:
It was another night where I was biking downtown around 3am or so. I had been riding up and down the streets taking pics of little architectural details I thought were interesting.
I pulled over and was taking pictures of these little squiggley things on the corners of one building when a squad pulled up and a cop got out. He walked up and asked me what I was doing out this late. I explained that I couldn't sleep so I had decided to go for a bike ride and take some pictures. He said that sounded like a pretty flimsy excuse and then asked me if I realised I was taking pictures of a federal building. I replied I wasn't aware of that.
Then he asked me for my for some ID. I handed him my drivers license, which he put in his pocket and then told me to turn around. I started to get pissed off as the handcuffs I had expected to get slapped on me did. He patted me down and put me in the back of his squad while he ran my ID.
After that came back clean, he let me out of the squad but didn't take the cuffs off. For the next 20 minutes he proceeded to bark questions at me. I was asked questions insinuating I was involved in everything from terrorism to drug dealing to pimping (exactly how many pimps ride around on a crappy Sears bicycle?). He went through my camera case and spent a good 2 minutes scrutinizing my tripod (maybe he thought it was a rocket launcher in disguise).
Up to this point I had been the epitome of politeness, but I had reached the ends of my patience. I demanded that he either release me or explain his reasonable suspicion and arrest me. He finally took the cuffs off and said I was free to go. But not before telling me that he wanted the film from my camera.
I explained that it was a digital camera and it had no film. He then requested the entire camera and I informed him that since he already all the information he needed, he was more than welcome to bring his ass to my house with a warrent and get it. I then proceeded to ride off into the moonlight.
For more of my good/bad adventures with LE, see this post and that post.
[last edit 7/26/2004 4:09 AM by Indigenous Insurgent - edited 1 times]
Those who make peaceful change impossible will make violent revolution inevitable. |
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NoSuchPerson
Stop, or I'll ask you again!
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 42 on 7/26/2004 6:43 AM >
| | | | I've never really had any bad experiences with Law Enforcement while doing UE, thankfully.
If a cop ever told me to get in his car for ANY reason, I would absolutely refuse. In Canada anyway, they can only forcibly put you in their car if you're under arrest. I did have one officer stop me while walking at 4am in a rather bad part of town (Regent Park, for those of you in Toronto). The officer asked me to get in his car while he checked me out on the computer, I simply said "No thanks, I'm fine here". He then said "You really should get in my car, I'd feel safer". Again, I just told him "I'm alright where I am, thanks" - you could tell he was pissed off, but there wasn't a damn thing he could do about it.
If an officer ever went through my stuff...camera bag or whatever, I'd have him charged with an illegal search. They are only allowed to inspect what is in plain sight, and cannot reach into a bag to search it - unless they have a warrent or if you give them permission.
I was parked with a friend on a street in Toronto going to explore the UofT buildings, when a cop pulled up behind us...asked the usual stuff about why are we out so late, etc... Well, we saw the trunk of the car we were in open - aparantly we'd left the key in there. But, these officers took it upon themselves to open the trunk and look around - which was totally illegal. Now, considering the circumstances, I didn't want to make a big stink of it (They COULD have nailed us for a few things, had they have known), so I just let it go, but it's things like that which REALLY piss me off. These cops need to learn we have rights and they have no authority to infringe upon them, unless they have a warrent - even then, they have to abstain from doing certain things.
I have NO problem with anybody...law enforcement or security, asking me what I'm up to, etc..., infact if they are polite to me, I'm completly polite and honest to them. It's when they turn into the "TV Cop" that I get pissed and start to pull the "I don't have to tell you" card. I've had more than a few spats with Security as a result of this. As you can probably imagine, I don't play well with contracted security
-Ex
Unit calling radio say again? |
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greywolf45
Location: U.S.A.
Gender: Male
Resident UER pain in the ass
| |  | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 43 on 7/27/2004 3:57 PM >
| | | | Hey Excaliber, if our governments do not trust us then why should we trust our governments? I think they are looking for an excuse to implement martial law, or looking for a way to do an end-run around the Constitution, here, and in Canada. It will be a mark of everlasting infamy if we were to allow it to
happen, wothout doing something about it.
"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends"
Martin Luther King Jr. |
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Plytheman
Location: Lawrence, Massachusetts
Obey The Deer
| |  | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 44 on 7/27/2004 10:47 PM >
| | | | Posted by moleman45
Hey Excaliber, if our governments do not trust us then why should we trust our governments? I think they are looking for an excuse to implement martial law, or looking for a way to do an end-run around the Constitution, here, and in Canada. It will be a mark of everlasting infamy if we were to allow it to
happen, wothout doing something about it.
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I could believe that. Retired Gen. Tommy Franks did say if there was another 9-11 esque terrorist attack that the constitution would be dismantled and a state of martial law would be inacted...
I'm achin, I'm shakin, I'm breakin, Like Humans Do!!
-Byrne |
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nd31
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 45 on 7/28/2004 12:53 AM >
| | | | Posted by Maxwell Smart
Prisoners awaiting trial have been known to copyright their name, then sue everyone in the courtroom that utters their name without consent. They don't usualy win anything from these frivolous suits (wrong suits...) but it delays their actual trial concerning their crime and gives them more time to set up their case, etc etc.
Basicly they do it to fuck with the system...
ndillon, we have no civil liberties anymore. Any that we do have can easily be rejected by a judge doing his job... not ruling over whats right or wrong, ruling in favor of the unjust laws.
Have any of you by chance seen the 'Protest Area' or 'Free Speech Area' at the Democratic Convention?
That picture isn't one of the sections with Razor wire adorning the top, but you can see the mesh they conected from the top of the fence to the green EL Track lines...
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My point exactly.
So many rights have been nullified, that they're no longer existent.
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Samurai
 
Vehicular Lord Rick
Location: northeastern New York
No matter where you go, there you are...
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 46 on 7/28/2004 3:24 AM >
| | | | Posted by ndillon31
My point exactly.
So many rights have been nullified, that they're no longer existent.
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no no no... you aren't thinking in governmental doublespeak. Rights haven't been nullified, they've been enhanced, modified, re-evaluated, re-worded, re-interpreted.
in other words, you're screwed.
Samurai
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Krenta
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Nope, wasn't me.
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 47 on 7/28/2004 8:02 PM >
|  | | | Posted by Indigenous Insurgent
Good Example:
I was riding around downtown on my bike late one evening and I noticed that the moon was especially big and bright. Riding around until I found a good spot, I hopped off my bike and took out my camera to snap some pics. I was futzing around with different camera settings when a cop pulled up next to me, and asked why I was taking pictures of the bridge...
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MacGuyver and I spent three weeknights, for more than two hours each, photographing road and rail bridges along the river, barges and tugboats, traffic trails, and trains, as well as the skylines, federal buildings, and a steam plant owned by the local utility company. Despite being visible from numerous roadways, the railroad, the bridges, and the roads on the other side of the river; despite playing with flashlights; despite walking down the median of a major, busy road; despite climbing the railing and standing on a narrow ledge over the river to get pictures; despite popping a couple manhole covers that looked interesting; despite inspecting several interesting-looking manhole lids and grates in the ground with flashlights, despite trespassing on a railroad right-of-way, and despite having parked in an out-of-the-way, county-employee reserved parking lot... we didn't get stopped once. Kind of disappointing, really.
We did get yelled at by a stuck-up valet outside an upscale dinner club, who demanded to know "the nature of our photography" as we photographed near - looking away from - the club, from the sidewalk, but once we'd explained that we weren't trying to blackmail anyone for having been at the club, he went away.
Considering that we were practically trying to get stopped, and neither of us really look like outstanding yuppie citizens nor were even remotely well-dressed... it makes me, at least, wonder about a lot of the "I got hassled by the man for taking pictures" stories I read and hear.
Have Speed Graphic, Will Travel. |
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JimBoylan
Location: SouthEast Pennsylvania, U. S. of A.
Gender: Male
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 48 on 8/2/2004 9:41 PM >
| | | | Posted by Krenta
Considering that neither of us really look like outstanding yuppie citizens nor
were even remotely well-dressed... it makes me, at least, wonder about a lot of
the "I got hassled by the man for taking pictures" stories I read and hear.
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Considering that the government claims that Bin Laden is filthy rich, they must
think that his henchmen are well dressed. If the Feds were really serious about
putting the guy away, they'd treat him like they did Al Capone (the Chicago
gangster during Prohibition) and send the Revenuers to get him for Income Tax
Evasion!
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IIVQ
 
Location: La Sud-Est du cité majeur du North-Holland (Bijlmer), .NL
Gender: Male
Back in Urbex!
| |  |  | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 49 on 8/2/2004 10:51 PM >
| | | | I got stopped by police/security 3 times, 2 times during UE.
Case one:
Railtracking with diggelfjoer on a really windy day, we put our bikes down because they would get blown over otherwise, we just went off trough some bushes to see a deserted railroad bridge and back in 10 minutes, to find two policemen watching our bikes. They got suspicios on two unattended unlocked bikes with our bags still on, without anyone nearby. We were told to stall our bikes in a less suspiciious way next time and to watch out for the expected storm.
Case two:
UEing with Kazil, Panic!, fred and diggelfjoer in Germany, we spent 3 hours in an old textile factory. On the grounds of this factory a new square and footbridge was being built, but this was all fenced off. In the factory we met a hobo and a man in a suit, him walking around and not looking strange at us.
Right at the time we wanted to go back to our car, a men walked toward us, saying he was from the security company of the premises and demanded to know what we were doing and who was our leader. Not much besides the truth we said we were looking at architecture and we didn't have a leader (that puzzled him, this was a real german who wasn't aware of the word "unorganized group").
Then he asked for our ID's, photographed them, called someone and read our names and ID numbers to him. Then he said he was going to escort us out of the grounds after he was sure we were clean (the other guy confirmed we were) and guided us outside. Then he barked that he didn't want to see us again, adding a friendly "tshuss". He wanted to make sure he was in charge, but he was behaving really correct.
Case three:
I drove trough France and my French isn't really good, but we were stopped by three police, one with a lorge gun in his hands, pointing down.
I was asked for the papers of the car (it's my mothers car and I had no clue where the papers were or how "papers" even looked, but found them) and my drivers licence. I was then told to switch off my big lights which I forgot to switch off as I only have the reflex to switch them off when I see an oncoming car, not when I see a light in the distance which I didn't take for a flashlight until really close. But it got some time for me to understand as my french isn't that good. Finally I was told "bonne route" but as I'm not used to that car, I let it shut down three times before I drove away slipping, I was scared as hell the guys would come after me again but fortunately they didn't.
But so far, no really negative experiences with cops. All have been not friendly (and not really unfriendly) but professional. Good luck for me I hope.
Posted by MapMan | 18/9/2005 19:25 | Hedy Lamarr made porn?
Posted by turbozutek | 20/9/2005 2:29 | Dude, educate us! |
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greywolf45
Location: U.S.A.
Gender: Male
Resident UER pain in the ass
| | | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 50 on 8/4/2004 12:33 AM >
| | | | I hope they never catch whoever it is. It would be victory for all UER'ers
if the photographer eludes the authorities.BTW, were the refineries he photographed active?
"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends"
Martin Luther King Jr. |
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greywolf45
Location: U.S.A.
Gender: Male
Resident UER pain in the ass
| | | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 51 on 8/4/2004 1:05 AM >
| | | | Posted by ExKa|iBuR
Ah, so you want to question me, eh?
Well Mr. Homeland Security Type... It's not illegal, so fuck you.
Anyway, yeah. I'm not a fan of having to explain myself to anyone.
-Ex
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Exkalibur, I feel the same way you do. In fact, i can get rather nasty when i feel that the situation calls for it. I should not have to explain myself to anyone. If i feel like taking pictures of any structure, or any other place, i will do it. But at the same time, the parinoia of the times is understandable, unfortunately.
[last edit 8/4/2004 1:11 AM by greywolf45 - edited 2 times]
"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends"
Martin Luther King Jr. |
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