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 PAexplorations
      
Location: Pennsylvania
Gender: Female
Medication Time...
 |  | Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
< on 7/19/2004 9:48 PM >
|  | | | Maybe it was just someone exploring?
HOUSTON (Reuters) - Law enforcement officials said on Monday they are looking for a man seen taking pictures of two refineries in Texas City, Texas.
Texas City, located on the Texas Gulf coast about 30 miles south of Houston, has three refineries including the largest U.S. plant operated by BP Plc., which is the third-largest U.S. refinery, processing 470,000 barrels of crude oil per day.
The man, described as white with dark hair, was seen taking pictures outside the refineries, all located on the same highway, at about 5 p.m. CDT on Saturday, said Bruce Clawson, emergency management and homeland security director for Texas City.
While it is not illegal to take pictures of a refinery from a highway or street, officials would like to talk to the man to find out his reason for taking the photographs.
"This is based on the idea that al Qaeda does its homework," Clawson said. "That's not to say we don't have enough home-grown idiots already who might want to do something."
The man was seen driving a white van.
Valero Energy Corp. operates a 243,000 barrel per day (bpd) refinery in Texas City. Marathon Ashland Petroleum LLC, a joint venture between Marathon Oil Corp., and Ashland Inc., operates a 76,000 bpd refinery in Texas City.
The U.S. Federal Bureau of Investigation has repeatedly warned refiners that they are possible targets for would-be terrorists. U.S. refinery security officials say their security guards regularly report people observing or taking pictures of refineries.
During the Independence Day holiday, ExxonMobil Corp. tightened security at the largest U.S. refinery, the 538,000 bpd plant in Baytown, Texas, 30 miles east of Houston, because of general warnings about possible terrorist activity.
Your hand is staining my window. |
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LearnedHand
Gender: Male
| |  | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 1 on 7/19/2004 9:57 PM >
| | | |
I think it's good that US officials are on their toes. As a photographer myself, I'd be willing to accept the fact that taking pictures of a refinery in todays environment might call a bit of unwanted attention to myself. I'm also confident in my abilities to prove to a government official that I'm not a terrorist should I be questioned.
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Indigenous Insurgent
Location: Milwaukee, WI
Gender: Male
Only the Truth is revolutionary
| |  |  | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 2 on 7/19/2004 10:01 PM >
| | | | I was just about to post that story.
THREAD STEALER!!! 
Those who make peaceful change impossible will make violent revolution inevitable. |
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PAexplorations
Location: Pennsylvania
Gender: Female
Medication Time...
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 3 on 7/19/2004 10:04 PM >
| | | | ooooooo sorrryyyyyy gotta be on your toes!! lol
Your hand is staining my window. |
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NoSuchPerson
 
Stop, or I'll ask you again!
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 4 on 7/19/2004 10:06 PM >
| | | | Ah, so you want to question me, eh?
Well Mr. Homeland Security Type... It's not illegal, so fuck you.
Anyway, yeah. I'm not a fan of having to explain myself to anyone.
-Ex
Unit calling radio say again? |
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Mark
Very Noble Donor
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
What is a lion, king of the savannah, when hes at the south pole?
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 5 on 7/20/2004 12:29 AM >
| | | | Well I have noted some odd threads poping up in other forums. Namely Radioreference. One guy was asking a lot of detailed questions about my air force base. There have been a lot middle eastern people taking pics of nuclear power plants as well. All legal but scary. I dont think anyone would care if you were taking pictures. They just want to make sure your not a terrorist. I wouldnt mind exsplaining myself to the authorities. I also get your point.
"If the threat level goes up its probably because of me." "I am looking for a girl who enjoys headbutting beltbuckles" |
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Silent Knight
Location: Niagara region
Gender: Male
Kastle Archives Productions Inc. (since 1999)
| | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 6 on 7/20/2004 12:40 AM >
| | | | Posted by ExKa|iBuR
Ah, so you want to question me, eh?
Well Mr. Homeland Security Type... It's not illegal, so fuck you.
Anyway, yeah. I'm not a fan of having to explain myself to anyone.
-Ex
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Hafta' agree with ya' there. Homeland security or not...I'd never feel obligated to explain legal activities myself to some half-wit either.
Silent Knight
You can always tell when you're watching Canadian television - the actors in the show are the same ones doing the commercials. |
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MatC
Nobler Donor
Location: ENY
Gender: Male
Accepted everywhere
| | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 7 on 7/20/2004 12:54 AM >
| | | | Posted by PaExplorations
While it is not illegal to take pictures of a refinery from a highway or street, officials would like to talk to the man to find out his reason for taking the photographs.
|
*sigh*
While I am all for having a secure environment in which to live, there is something very scary about the phrase, "While it is not illegal to ... [do whatever] ... officials would like to talk to the man." This is getting dangerously close to some form of doublethink. No, it's not illegal to do what you're doing, but we're going to arrest you for it anyway.*
* -- Yes, I know that's not what happened here, but what are they going to ask the guy? "Excuse me, are you a terrorist?" "Oh, golly gee, yes I am -- you caught me." Besides, what the hell can they do him even if they find him? Unless he has an outstanding warrant, they can't arrest him for doing something that's not illegal! (Not yet, anyway.) They can hold him for a little while, but again, unless he has committed a crime, they have to let him go.
-- Mat
"We shall not cease from exploration / And the end of all our exploring / Will be to arrive where we started / And know the place for the first time."
- T.S. Eliot, excerpt from "Little Gidding" |
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Mark
Very Noble Donor
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
What is a lion, king of the savannah, when hes at the south pole?
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 8 on 7/20/2004 1:21 AM >
| | | | Its not that bad. If hes wanted for questioning in a good enviroment he walks in says hey my names Bob what do you want.
C:why were you photographic the refineries?
B: Father use to work there
C: Can you prove it?
B: go do some resarch in the companies file for ________
C: Ok dont leave town untill this cleared up
B: Ok Im going back to work heres my number
A day or two later boom they find out hes not some terrorist.
Granted thats a perfect world. If things went that way then we wouldnt worry about things like this. Lets hope since it was in the newspaper no one gets stupid.
"If the threat level goes up its probably because of me." "I am looking for a girl who enjoys headbutting beltbuckles" |
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Freak
Location: Usually Alaska, now MSP.
Gender: Male
Hypocrite
| | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 9 on 7/20/2004 2:01 AM >
| | | | I think that in the interest of National Security anyone with a view of any refinery, power plant, or government building should immediately paint over their windows. Also, they should close their eyes when driving by such installations so they don't accidentally see a vulnerability.
Turn off the internet and go play outside.
http://spamusement...hp/comics/view/137 |
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Plytheman
Location: Lawrence, Massachusetts
Obey The Deer
| | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 10 on 7/20/2004 2:14 AM >
| | | | Remember, you Can Help Big Brother Too!! If anyone you know is Acting odd, Report them IMEDIATLY!
Who the hell cares if it WAS illegal to do before, its legal now!
http://www.thekansascitychannel.com/news/3535855/detail.html
I'm achin, I'm shakin, I'm breakin, Like Humans Do!!
-Byrne |
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Samurai
Vehicular Lord Rick
Location: northeastern New York
No matter where you go, there you are...
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 11 on 7/20/2004 2:16 AM >
| | | | I see both sides of this discussion, but damnit, what happens when your law enforcement starts seeing everyone as the enemy?
Case in point- a little observation...
back in 2000, i lived in tennessee, 3 miles from Watts Bar nuclear plant and about 25 miles from Sequoya Nuclear outside of Soddy-Daisy. After work some nights if it was unbearably hot, I would take a ride over to the access that the TVA had built and watch barges go in and out of the lock on the damn, listening to the radio, in full view of the nuke plant. No one bothered me, no one rolled up and asked what i was doing sitting at a dam at 2am in a battered Daytona. No cops. And this is on a kinda lonely stretch of TN Route 68.
In my photo album, I have pics of the nuclear plant... that must mean I am a terrorist, right?
What would happen to me in 2004?
here's a picture of the 'target'... now you guys are all my accomplices!
Samurai
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Duke
Noble Donor
Location: Awww-shitby, Ontario
Gender: Male
Move it or lose it
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 12 on 7/20/2004 2:26 AM >
| | | | Mark, I think in that case they would actually then pull the father in to question him about his links to the Al Qaeda. People seem to think they can talk their way out of being a suspected terrorist. Ever heard of the patriot act? Ever heard of Guantanamo Bay? the American government has the power to drag you out of your house and send you to Cuba with NO rights whatsover, no right to council, no trial, NOTHING. They won't necessarily always go to that length, but I find it scary that they have that power. I had to deal with police up here in Canada for being a suspected terrorist because of my god damned Halloween costume. Spent a night wearing a paper jumpsuit on a concrete bed in a cell, didn't get a phone-call, nothing. Had to go through court for AGES to straighten things out, I don't even WANT to imagine how much worse it is in the states. Although, I think EVERYONE who drives around in a big white van should be subject to random spot-checks. I mean, come on, there's a reason we call em diddler-vans.
Contrary to popular belief, death isn't just for dead people. I know I was surprised too! It can happen to anybody! Horses, fiddler crabs, even a potato can die! - Tick
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Mark
Very Noble Donor
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
What is a lion, king of the savannah, when hes at the south pole?
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 13 on 7/20/2004 3:02 AM >
| | | | NO offense but you people are seeing Big Brother in your TV sets and in storys. Not everyone thinks your a terrorist and not everyone takes the concept of the patriot act the same way. Its like anything on this planet it can be used for good or evil. I can stab you with a butter knife in the eye and however it was never inteded to kill.
Look people there are going to be whack jobs who think your a terrorist because you take pics of industrial sites. Most laymen people will look at you and think your an idiot for your hobby. Then there are people out there that will be dumb enough to let a terrorist into there home and do anything for them.
Basicly what Im trying to say is you guys are getting scared of your own shadow and it just isnt necesary. I bet tons of you smoke illegal substances. How many of you have been dragged in? If you think there going to come after you for taking pictures after showing them this site then your nuts. Not to mention most people who go to Guantonimo probably are pretty suspect. Not saying all and not saying unjust things dont happen but being scared of the boogy man wont make you any more safe.
"If the threat level goes up its probably because of me." "I am looking for a girl who enjoys headbutting beltbuckles" |
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BigPoppaMikey
This user has been banned. See the banlist page for more details.
Location: Milpitas, California
Gender: Male
Don't follow me unless you want to...
| |  |  | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 14 on 7/20/2004 4:36 AM >
| | | | A couple of months ago, we talked about this. I posted in the thread of when my company (then Philips Environmental) had me at the Conoco-Phillips refinery in Billings, Montana.
Two local high school kids were caught taking pictures of the refinery for a school project. Both were arrested (not charged), cameras and film confiscated, and told to never do it again. The camera was later given back to the school.
While not illegal, authorities GREATLY frown on ANYONE taking pictures of refineries, power plants, nuke sites, oilwells, etc. Believe me when I say that the police WILL drop all other calls short of 11-99 and 187 to investigate a potential terrorist threat. Because that is what they consider a person taking these pictures, a terrorist threat. Whether they are or not...
BPM
Wishing I was Jack Dalton just to have all the cool leftovers... |
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HagensborgViking
Location: Fernwood, Victoria
Gender: Male
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 15 on 7/20/2004 4:56 AM >
|  | | | Nothing pisses me off more than authorities who think there just the hottest shit. Sounds to me like these dick-lips need three less bearclaws a day.
Anyone who abuses their power to treat kids like that need a kick in the itty-bits. I mean itty.
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BigPoppaMikey
This user has been banned. See the banlist page for more details.
Location: Milpitas, California
Gender: Male
Don't follow me unless you want to...
| | | | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 16 on 7/20/2004 5:00 AM >
| | | | As far as I know, it was at the request of the refinery 'officials' because they felt that the "potential" for a security breach was there in picture taking.
Who knows...
Wishing I was Jack Dalton just to have all the cool leftovers... |
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Freak
Location: Usually Alaska, now MSP.
Gender: Male
Hypocrite
| | | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 17 on 7/20/2004 5:44 AM >
| | | | I got chased off from a refinery in the town of North Pole, a little redneck town near Fairbanks with its whole economy based on oil and looking like a set from a bad christmas movie. The cop was so bored he had to make up a story about French terrorists threatening the refinery (yeah right buddy, the french are going to come over here and blow up a worthless little refinery in the middle of nowhere). About a week later some students were detained and questioned by the FBI and the Air Force (wtf?) for taking pictures of the same refinery.
I think a big part of it is that local police departments and state governments are getting a lot of money to improve "homeland security", and want to look like they're spending it on something useful. For example, our governor suddenly decided he deserves to have a private jet, purchased with homeland security funds... I guess he'll fly around informing local authorities of the dangers of journalism students near refineries.
Turn off the internet and go play outside.
http://spamusement...hp/comics/view/137 |
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Samurai
Vehicular Lord Rick
Location: northeastern New York
No matter where you go, there you are...
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 18 on 7/20/2004 1:03 PM >
| | | | Posted by Mark
Basicly what Im trying to say is you guys are getting scared of your own shadow and it just isnt necesary. I bet tons of you smoke illegal substances. How many of you have been dragged in? If you think there going to come after you for taking pictures after showing them this site then your nuts. Not to mention most people who go to Guantonimo probably are pretty suspect. Not saying all and not saying unjust things dont happen but being scared of the boogy man wont make you any more safe.
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I don't think scared of our own shadow is the right term, Mark... I think what we're collectively getting freaked out about is the fact that once mundane sites that meant absolutely dick are now becoming flirts with a law that no one wants, understands or really needs.
The white van thing, well... i drive a white van at work...
The question here, again(!), is the validity of having someone come up to you, demand YOUR personal property, take the film/memory out of it and then question you. I really feel that this is stepping on the toes of the constitution a bit. This sort of thing is what we've seen in movies of so-called fascist or communist states (surely, not as severe as those, but you are getting my drift.) How long would it realistically take to become something like that.
Anyways, i think you guys know what i am talking about. I am so tired, i can't tell if this makes sense or not.
(If it doesn't it, delete it...  )
Samurai
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Revenant
Location: Montreal
Gender: Male
Back from the grave
| | Re: Man Sought for Photographing Texas City Refineries
<Reply # 19 on 7/20/2004 5:33 PM >
|  | | | Posted by Equivokal
I think it's good that US officials are on their toes. As a photographer myself, I'd be willing to accept the fact that taking pictures of a refinery in todays environment might call a bit of unwanted attention to myself. I'm also confident in my abilities to prove to a government official that I'm not a terrorist should I be questioned.
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Who cares about proof, they got the patriot act.
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