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 insainly sound
    
Location: Bay Area, CA
Gender: Female
How'd we get here, and how are we getting out of here?!
 |  |  | Us V. "Them"
< on 2/17/2008 5:08 PM >
|  | | | So the reason for this thread is I went to one of my favorite sites which happens to be this tagged to hell old warehouse 10 mins from where I live. I happened across a bunch of taggers while in this building, and I asked them why they were doing what they were doing, and they didn't have an answer, so I tried to put myself in there shoes, and came back with this epiphany.
We are there for the buildings to become part of our history, and in someways to preserve the buildings, whereas the taggers are selfish, they want the building to be part of their history, and for them to be part of the buildings history.
Perhaps that is an extremely over simplified way of looking at it, but it makes sense on some level, if nothing else it explains why we're there
Check out my photo blog! |
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SkaSkank
Location: North East
Gender: Male
You can't wait for inspiration, you have to go after it with a club.
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 1 on 2/17/2008 5:14 PM >
| | | | I agree with you. History is something that should be treated with respect, It should not be tainted by some ignorant kid going into a building and writing swears on a wall. History should be shared by all, not stolen by some kid.
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jewtewned
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Ft. Worth, Tx
Gender: Male
Put the fucking lotion in the basket!
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 2 on 2/17/2008 5:19 PM >
| | | | It is a rare opportunity to run into taggers while in a place. I would love that chance. I don't honestly know what I would say or do, but I would love to have my paint ball gun with me.
"If ya like paint, here some more you little bastards!"
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dsankt
 
Location: live and in the fresh
| |  | | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 3 on 2/17/2008 5:25 PM >
| | | | It is a rare opportunity to run into paintballers while in a place. I would love that chance. I don't honestly know what I would say or do, but I would love to have my gun with me.
"If ya like ammunition, here some more you little bastards!"
Incase you unaware some gorgeous buildings have been killed by paintballers. As explorers we're always fighting a losing battle. Lock up your sites if you can, keep them low key, and make sure you get in early.
sleepycity.net: watch out for the third rail baby, that shit is high voltage. urbex and urban exploration photography |
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Freak
Location: Usually Alaska, now MSP.
Gender: Male
Hypocrite
| | | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 4 on 2/17/2008 5:26 PM >
| | | | Sounds nice and straightforward to me. I've seen a lot of people try to overanalyze taggers and vandals, wondering what the socio-pshcyological motivation is for people to cause willful damage to historic sites and purposefully take away from the future enjoyment of other visitors. While there are indeed some real artists who use grafitti as an outlet or statement, I doubt that most casual taggers go about their actions with such a deep analysis of their rammifications. The average teen vandal is probably thinking something more along the lines of "damn I'm stoned, that wall looks like a good place to tag up, huhhuhuh I drew a dick huhuhuh".
Turn off the internet and go play outside.
http://spamusement...hp/comics/view/137 |
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jewtewned
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Ft. Worth, Tx
Gender: Male
Put the fucking lotion in the basket!
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 5 on 2/17/2008 5:30 PM >
| | | | I see your point about paintballers. Ive never played in a building before only out in the woods. In my area, tagging is everywhere(im sure it is in most places)
I was just speaking out of frustration.
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dsankt
Location: live and in the fresh
| | | | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 6 on 2/17/2008 5:33 PM >
| | | | Posted by jewtewned
I see your point about paintballers. Ive never played in a building before only out in the woods. In my area, tagging is everywhere(im sure it is in most places)
I was just speaking out of frustration.
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I understand. One of my favourite sites (a tunnel - so the graff will be there forever) got totally painted and it's sad to see. The old sandstone tunnel existed there for 50-100 years just fine, then a couple of people come along and destroy the whole thing in less than an hour. What can ya do against such shortsighted people?
sleepycity.net: watch out for the third rail baby, that shit is high voltage. urbex and urban exploration photography |
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jewtewned
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Ft. Worth, Tx
Gender: Male
Put the fucking lotion in the basket!
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 7 on 2/17/2008 5:41 PM >
| | | | You can't do anything about it. Cause as soon as those people are gone, there will be more behind them. Nature of people I guess...
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Brooks
Location: Fall River Ma
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 8 on 2/17/2008 5:43 PM >
| | | | Tagging sucks but people have been doing it forever. Also the kids writing swears on the walls arent graffiti artists there just jerks
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uLiveAndYouBurn
Location: Beyond
Anarchocommunist
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 9 on 2/17/2008 7:32 PM >
| | | | People just like to be able to scrawl shit in really big letters on a wall.
At my school there is a pedestrian tunnel that goes under the railroad tracks that divide campus. Students are allowed to graffiti it and consequently no serious artists paint there because your piece will get covered over within a few hours.
"Aint nothin' to it but to do it"
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kowalski
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 10 on 2/17/2008 8:23 PM >
| | | | Posted by insainly sound
We are there for the buildings to become part of our history, and in someways to preserve the buildings, whereas the taggers are selfish, they want the building to be part of their history, and for them to be part of the buildings history.
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How is formulation "A" any different from formulation "B"? Maybe you've just been sloppy in your wording, but you seem to be saying the exact same thing in both cases, except assigning one of them "selfishness" while elevating the other. I'm not convinced, and in fact other observers have suggested that urban exploration is an extremely selfish pursuit.
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b-Rizzle
Location: New Jersey
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 11 on 2/17/2008 9:47 PM >
| | | | Formulation A -
| We are there for the buildings to become part of our history, and in someways to preserve the buildings |
Formulation B -
| taggers are selfish, they want the building to be part of their history, and for them to be part of the buildings history. |
The OP stated that there is some similarity between explorers and taggers in that we all want the buildings to become a part of our "history".
I believe what he meant (correct me if I am wrong) is that the difference lies in the fact that taggers are being selfish and feel the need to make themselves a part of the building as well.
| I'm not convinced, and in fact other observers have suggested that urban exploration is an extremely selfish pursuit. |
Urban Exploration is undoubtedly selfish (unless you only explore to show everyone on UER), however the main point is that most of us do not sacrifice the sites we visit for the sake of our selfishness.
Didn't mean to pick apart your post kowalski, just trying to bring some clarity?
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G to the Race
Hi!
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 12 on 2/18/2008 12:19 AM >
| | | | Posted by kowalski
How is formulation "A" any different from formulation "B"? Maybe you've just been sloppy in your wording, but you seem to be saying the exact same thing in both cases, except assigning one of them "selfishness" while elevating the other. I'm not convinced, and in fact other observers have suggested that urban exploration is an extremely selfish pursuit.
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Unless you spend your free time giving away food, you'd be taxed to find a "pursuit" that isn't selfish. Heck, even giving away food is self-centered in a way. Taggers are mostly young kids who don't have another outlet for their frustration--they have so little esteem that they feel their name on a wall will get them some. The difference between them and explorers is the whole Sierra club thing. Of course explorers disdain them but they aren't ever going to stop them.
You betcha |
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maypost
Location: North, South, East, West, all around... then down to the underground
Gender: Male
Exploring if for n00bz0rz
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 13 on 2/18/2008 12:22 AM >
| | | | The only people that are more annoying than Kowalski are the idiots who reply to is utter bullshit.
Pretend he is not there, it is the best way to deal with arrogant people.
As far as getting worked up about vandals and taggers, it is outside our control, so why let it get to you?
Exploring is like tattoos... They stopped being cool in 2005
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KevinOger
Location: Raleighwood, NC
Gender: Male
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 14 on 2/18/2008 1:40 AM >
| | | | if someone is tagging in a low key area, for example in a tunnel, in the bowels of a building, and they are creating a real piece, not just scrawling or throwing up some scribble, they're there to practice. the only way you get good is to make a lot of pieces at full scale. you get a handle on paint use, can counts, time and technique. i don't like seeing graffiti on beautiful old buildings either, but, i do understand why it gets made in some instances. i get mad when someone refinishes furniture, let alone entire structures.
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Nick
Location: Lansing, MI
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 15 on 2/18/2008 2:14 AM >
| | | | It comes to a point where you almost wish you could create some sort of UE movement, some large organization that secures abandoned historical buildings from vandals and such and documents the buildings with photos... it'd be nice, but it's unlikely.
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don cornelius
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Your asshole.
Proud Parent
| | | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 16 on 2/18/2008 2:18 AM >
| | | | Posted by maypost
The only people that are more annoying than Kowalski are the idiots who reply to is utter bullshit.
Pretend he is not there, it is the best way to deal with arrogant people.
As far as getting worked up about vandals and taggers, it is outside our control, so why let it get to you?
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All three of these comments could not be more on the mark. well said.
40+ year olds with Myspace pages are not cool, they are pediphiles on the prowl. Buyer beware. |
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micro
Gender: Male
Slowly I turned
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 17 on 2/18/2008 2:58 AM >
| | | | Posted by Nick
It comes to a point where you almost wish you could create some sort of UE movement, some large organization that secures abandoned historical buildings from vandals and such and documents the buildings with photos... it'd be nice, but it's unlikely.
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Very unlikely. If you care about a building, work with your local preservation board or a similar group. For the most part, urban explorers are only interested in keeping buildings in a state of disrepair. So long as they continue to place more value on decay than regeneration, they will continue to be exact opposite of preservationists.
Put another way: these are not the droids you are looking for.
[last edit 2/18/2008 2:59 AM by micro - edited 1 times]
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maypost
Location: North, South, East, West, all around... then down to the underground
Gender: Male
Exploring if for n00bz0rz
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 18 on 2/18/2008 3:15 AM >
| | | | Posted by micro
Very unlikely. If you care about a building, work with your local preservation board or a similar group. For the most part, urban explorers are only interested in keeping buildings in a state of disrepair. So long as they continue to place more value on decay than regeneration, they will continue to be exact opposite of preservationists.
Put another way: these are not the droids you are looking for.
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You are making me all wet
Exploring is like tattoos... They stopped being cool in 2005
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KevinOger
Location: Raleighwood, NC
Gender: Male
| | Re: Us V. "Them"
<Reply # 19 on 2/18/2008 3:44 AM >
| | | | Posted by micro
Very unlikely. If you care about a building, work with your local preservation board or a similar group. For the most part, urban explorers are only interested in keeping buildings in a state of disrepair. So long as they continue to place more value on decay than regeneration, they will continue to be exact opposite of preservationists.
Put another way: these are not the droids you are looking for.
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if you could see my finger, it's currently on my nose.
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