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 Avatar-X
       
Alpha Husky
Location: West Coast
Gender: Male
yay!
 |  |  | Administrative Power and Personal Insult
< on 6/23/2004 3:36 PM >
|  | | | Try this on any other forum, community, mailing list, or other group in which one person is the owner/admin/man in charge.
Sign up for an account, and then, either in private message or in the forum, call the head admin an asshole, a nazi, a fucktard, or all of the above. Be creative! Try your best to piss him/her off as much as possible.
Now, count the seconds until you are banned. I can guarantee it will be less than a minute from the time that the admin reads the message.
The lesson here is: Pissing off the admin of a group you do not own, is a bad idea.
Now, to the point of my post. On this board, we have a set of rules, which are enforced by the administration team. Everyone should be familiar with the rules, since there are numerous methods used to ensure that the board has read them.
We've never banned anyone unless they violated the rules. (there have been some accidental bans but they have been reversed). Specifically, I haven't banned anyone simply because they personally insulted me.
What I'm trying to get at here is: Should I? If you were running this site, would you ban people who sent you messages that were crafted so cunningly to anger you, and for no other purpose?
I personally don't like the idea of banning people for insulting me. However, in return, I expect the membership to grant me at least a little bit of respect, in that they really shouldn't send me messages that have no purpose except to anger me. That's just unacceptable.
Opinions?
huskies - such fluff. |
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Macsbug
Noble Donor
Location: St. Paul, MN
Gender: Male
Safety First!
| |  | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 1 on 6/23/2004 3:40 PM >
| | | | Why not just making some sort of rule against harrassing PM's? - If asked to stop, and the other party does not, they get a strike or a warning or whatever.
That should take care of your problem, and wouldn't make you appear to be a dictator admin/mod or anything, I would think. Hows that sound?
"Believe those who are seeking the truth; doubt those who find it." |
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Ricotta
Nobler Donor
Location: Houston, TX
Gender: Male
De arimasu~
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 2 on 6/23/2004 3:48 PM >
| | | | I say go for it. It's not like most of the people that are pushing your buttons intentionally have really contributed to the site, be it with time, money, or both. Hell, there's nothing stopping them from coding their own forums.
In fact, I think that a good start would be to put Godwin's Law into the rules. That way anytime someone refers to the forum staff as National Socialists, you can end the thread right then. Most threads degenerate into bitching and flaming at that point, so there's not much loss.
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Rust
 
I am a rustbucket
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 3 on 6/23/2004 3:48 PM >
| | | | Nonsense. You can't just walk up to someone in real life and start spewing insults at them, so why should you be allowed to online, or on this board, specifically?
On pretty much all the other boards I'm a member of, people would be immediately banned for such an offence.
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Revenant
Location: Montreal
Gender: Male
Back from the grave
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 4 on 6/23/2004 4:32 PM >
| | | | Well if the admin is truly an asshole, and bans anyone who disagrees with him then id have to judge the consequences of my actions first. Do i like the community more than my urge to tell the admin like it is? If i like the community more ill just shut up for a while until everyone sees it and something can be done about it collectively. If i dont care much about keeping in touch with the community then i will just tell the admin whats up publicly to do others a favor who cant do it for fear of a ban. Im just speaking in general terms here, im not talking about you Av-X
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Burzum
Noble Donor
| | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 5 on 6/23/2004 4:33 PM >
| | | | its yr board, Av.
since you didn't charge anyone anything, you should be able to decide who stays and who goes.
i don't know you personally, so i don't know where your limits are, but I wouldn't put up with some of the crap that has been thrown yr way - and a ban can always be reversed if the situation changes.
that said, the UE community will always be an unruly and anarchistic bunch (otherwise we wouldn't do this stuff), so a certain amount of anti-authority anger is always going to be thrown yr way - not out of personal animosity as much as a general dislike for rules and the enforcement of them.
www.rouskrew.com
because evil won't just do itself. |
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xrahy
Noble Donor
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 6 on 6/23/2004 4:36 PM >
| | | | Posted by Avatar-X
Try this on any other forum, community, mailing list, or other group in which one person is the owner/admin/man in charge.
Sign up for an account, and then, either in private message or in the forum, call the head admin an asshole, a nazi, a fucktard, or all of the above. Be creative! Try your best to piss him/her off as much as possible.
Now, count the seconds until you are banned. I can guarantee it will be less than a minute from the time that the admin reads the message.
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I am really looking forward to trying this. Any suggestions on what forum(s) I should choose? 
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The Hitman's Daughter
Account Closed
Location: ottawa, canada
Gender: Female
hot pavement.
| | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 7 on 6/23/2004 4:50 PM >
| | | | how about i just go beat them up? Like the end of Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back. They can't type harrassing PMs to people if their arms and legs are broken.
richellesart.com
From now on and until the end of time, "Hip To Be Square" will conjure images of bloody bodies being hacked apart with axes.
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Servo
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 8 on 6/23/2004 4:50 PM >
| | | | Posted by Macsbug
Why not just making some sort of rule against harrassing PM's? - If asked to stop, and the other party does not, they get a strike or a warning or whatever.
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Not sure if this is the best idea because then it just spills over into the public forums. Maybe a way to ignore certain people's PMs would better tackle this issue...
As for Av's problem... well I'll tell ya, when I ran a forum, people generally got banned without warning for insulting me or the mods. Then they'd have to apologize to get let back in.  I'm not advocating any kind of "Zero Tolerance" policy like this (and if I had it to do again I would do it differently), but I'm also saying maybe the best policy is not to just ignore them either. Perhaps do it the same way you do with other rule-breaking, give them a warning then ban them if it continues?
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Jesus Jones
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: back in Belleville
Gender: Male
1973-2005
| | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 9 on 6/23/2004 5:01 PM >
| | | | I think a one or teo strike policy toward harrasing PM's and insulting Mods/Admins should be placed in effect. Remember the huge war over Shane being called a Forum Nazi because he was doing his job?>
[11:23:20] * nightbird looks at jj's crotch in amazement
[19:48:06] <Freak> YOUR TOAD A SPLODE
[22:04:21] <keti> in fact, im rather robotic Virginity does not collect intrest. -Andrea [15:44:19] <Kellogs> i'm part of a complete breakfast you know =P wait...that sounds so wrong |
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Ninjalicious
Gone, but always with us
Location: Toronto
| | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 10 on 6/23/2004 5:02 PM >
|  | | | Everyone's entitled not to be harassed, but I don't think admins should have some special protection from insult, especially since some of us dish it out rather frequently ourselves. Learn to ignore people whose opinions you don't care about. And if you do care about their opinions, then making a rule that they can't tell you their opinions seems a bit silly.
Ninj
http://www.infiltration.org
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Avatar-X
Alpha Husky
Location: West Coast
Gender: Male
yay!
| | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 11 on 6/23/2004 5:06 PM >
| | | | I care about almost everyone here. By your guide, Ninj, I'd have to ignore pretty much everyone who sends me rude or nasty messages, unless they are a close friend of mine.
For example, recently a forum member wanted me to perform an administrative task for them. I informed this person that I would do it when I got a chance. He continued to send messages, which became more and more rude and hostile.
At that point, should I have said "You know what? I don't like how you're treating me, so I'm not going to do you this favour"? Maybe.
-av
huskies - such fluff. |
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Krenta
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Nope, wasn't me.
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 12 on 6/23/2004 5:09 PM >
|  | | | Having been on (quite briefly!) another UE forum who have a negative tolerance policy - "We'll ban people who we think might be troublemakers, or who we just don't like, before they've even done anything" - I'm continually shocked by the amount of crap Av lets people fling at him, and his ability to restrain himself from hunting them down and flaying them with barbed wire. A lot of others have come in for their (un)fair share of abuse, as well.1
It'd be nice if we could just say "use common sense", but that seems to be sorely lacking here.
1: Which is not to say that there haven't been people here who deserved, indeed, pretty much begged for, a little well-placed abuse, of course...
Have Speed Graphic, Will Travel. |
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agent-x
Noble Donor
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 13 on 6/23/2004 5:09 PM >
| | | | Posted by Son Of Sam
I think a one or teo strike policy toward harrasing PM's and insulting Mods/Admins should be placed in effect. |
so there's a rule that ordinary members can harass the Mods, but not a rule for the reverse? the obvious problem as Ninj points out, is that the insults can flow in both directions. this rule would give them free reign to write insulting messages to members, knowing that a similarly-worded reply from the member will result in bannination.
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um...Vince
Location: Toronto
Gender: Male
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 14 on 6/23/2004 5:20 PM >
| | | | Posted by Avatar-X
If you were running this site, would you ban people who sent you messages that were crafted so cunningly to anger you, and for no other purpose?
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Absolutely not! That is one of the poorest ways to deal with the situation I can think of. With great power comes great responsibility, and as the absolute authority on UER, you should be able to deal with the situation with a bit more finese.
Here's how I would do it.
First, change their board name to something really, really boastful and lame. Like "The Ultimate God of UE!!!!!!"
Second, share their insulting nature with everyone else leaving messages in forums that insult everyone. If possible, do so while posting as much of their real world contact info as possible.
Third, start a journal for them, or add to the one that already exists. Start with a normal sounding post, and then have in sidetrack to wanting some feedback about their concerns for their recent physical attraction to one of their parents, and possibly a family pet. "This happens to everyone, right?"
Lastly, enter a UE database location on their behalf entitled "My Pants". Minimal info; so far, no one, including the poster, has found it interesting enough to explore. Suggested gear includes peanut butter and disinfectant.
Now, I know some people might call this an abuse of power.
um...Vince.
edit: punctuation.
[last edit 6/23/2004 5:21 PM by um...Vince - edited 1 times]
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agent-x
Noble Donor
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 15 on 6/23/2004 5:34 PM >
| | | | (repost with a bit of editing, after deletion by a Mod):
you sound like Brando in The Godfather, "you gotta show me some respect". oh wait, was that an insult, maybe I should retract it in case i get banned?
Explanation of what I mean and how this applies to the discussion:
The whole issue of what's considered an insult is completely subjective. In trying to make a humorous point above, I perhaps have insulted AV-X. Which could then, if this new proposed rule is added, result in my being banned. oops, but I was just trying to be funny, I might argue. But you broke the rules, they'd reply.
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Coyote-X
This member has been banned
Gender: Male
I post hunky animal versions of myself to make up for real-life shortcomings!
| | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 16 on 6/23/2004 7:08 PM >
| | | | Oh, cry me a fucking river.
It's your damn forum, and you can ban whoever you want. That's your right. Just don't be surprised when people lose respect for you when you start using banning as a tool to deal with people who hurt your "precious feelings."
Here's another idea: Get some thicker fucking skin. Chances are, you probably said something not-so-nice, whether you realize it or not, to cause it in the first place.
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Ninjalicious
Gone, but always with us
Location: Toronto
| | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 17 on 6/23/2004 7:18 PM >
| | | | I think we'd be better off if no new policy or rule were to be introduced, but if it is, I suggest that whatever new protection you award to yourself you share with everyone on the board. That seems more fair to me.
Ninj
http://www.infiltration.org
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Avatar-X
Alpha Husky
Location: West Coast
Gender: Male
yay!
| | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 18 on 6/23/2004 7:22 PM >
| | | | I am in the process of coding an "IM Block" feature. This way, when someone pisses you off via PM, you don't have to speak to them again, ever.
huskies - such fluff. |
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uem-Tux
Iron Wok Jan
Location: Montreal
Gender: Male
UE Geek
| |  | | Re: Administrative Power and Personal Insult
<Reply # 19 on 6/23/2004 7:31 PM >
| | | | If I were in your shoes Av, I'd run the board how it pleased me to run it. If my way of doing things wasn't popular, well, my detractors could go chat somewhere else. I wouldn't ban them unless they were abusive in public.
I think you do a perfectly good job, and as Mako is putting (rather bluntly) it, the only time your judgement seems clouded is when your feelings are hurt or your pride is injured.
Being envelopped in a constant shit-storm is unfortunately sort of in your job description. You can choose to approach it with a sense of humour, or with guns (bans) blazing. It's up to you.
Urban Exploration Montreal
Why are you the way that you are? |
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