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 Live-Bait
  
 |  | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 20 on 6/8/2008 12:02 AM >
|  | | | Posted by comrade 47
That's what I meant.
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if you are going to give legal advice you best know how to communicate the specifics and details of the law in question.
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junkyard
Location: LaCrosse, WI
Gender: Male
Strategic Beer Command where the metal hits the meat.
| |  | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 21 on 6/10/2008 3:40 AM >
| | | | Yeah, but I tossed him a cold one and my buddy had like $8 in singles he threw up in the air. He was so confused, caught the beer out of instinct I guess and stopped long enough to pick up the cash while we ran back the way we came. I'm sure it took him 2.4 seconds to figure out they were nothing but singles.....not even a fiver in there. But still, 8 bucks and a beer ain't a bad tip and you know he wasn't going to tell the bossman. You enjoy the cold brew while no one's looking and keep the money. It also makes a damn good story. So if nothing is broken or stolen, who the fuck is gonna know? Works like a charm.
Note: Does not work with warm beer. At least it wouldn't with me, so don't try it.
I drink gasoline for breakfeast and beer for dinner!
Any problem can be licked with a case of beer and a few sticks of dynamite.
Strategic Beer Command ruling the desert since 1995 http://www.strategic-beer-command.com |
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distorted void
Location: Illinois
Gender: Male
What you risk shows what you value.
| |  | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 22 on 6/15/2008 12:19 AM >
| | | | Posted by junkyard
Yeah, but I tossed him a cold one and my buddy had like $8 in singles he threw up in the air. He was so confused, caught the beer out of instinct I guess and stopped long enough to pick up the cash while we ran back the way we came. I'm sure it took him 2.4 seconds to figure out they were nothing but singles.....not even a fiver in there. But still, 8 bucks and a beer ain't a bad tip and you know he wasn't going to tell the bossman. You enjoy the cold brew while no one's looking and keep the money. It also makes a damn good story. So if nothing is broken or stolen, who the fuck is gonna know? Works like a charm.
Note: Does not work with warm beer. At least it wouldn't with me, so don't try it.
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Dude, again, Junkyard is hilarious.
I love doing things in which others have no idea even exist, dont you? |
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junkyard
Location: LaCrosse, WI
Gender: Male
Strategic Beer Command where the metal hits the meat.
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 23 on 6/15/2008 11:07 PM >
| | | | It probably worked just for the sheer stupid factor. I can almost guarantee you that nobody has ever tried that with security before. And I'm not above bribery if it means a clean get away and only one Broken Arrow.
I drink gasoline for breakfeast and beer for dinner!
Any problem can be licked with a case of beer and a few sticks of dynamite.
Strategic Beer Command ruling the desert since 1995 http://www.strategic-beer-command.com |
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krot
Location: Scarborough, Ontario
Gender: Male
| |  | CITIZEN's ARREST / Powers of a security guard
<Reply # 24 on 7/11/2008 1:28 AM >
| | | | Well, having worked as a part-time guard 5 yrs. ago, I want to say this:
Security guards have no more rights than the owner of the property, which they are protecting. Security guards do not have police officers' rights.
But having said that, they DO have a right to a so called "CITIZEN's ARREST". Any person has a right to execute a citizen's arrest on somebody who is breaking the law. If it is withing common sense limits, of course. The only requirement is that you must NOT search that person and you are only allowed to remove tools or devices, which the arrested person can use to free himself, harm himself or someone else. Also, you must call police immediately after you perform citizen's arrest. This is the law in Ontario. So, it is NOT true that security guard has no right to touch you at all. For example, if you go to Loblaw's and see that a guy is beating an old lady, you have a right to stop and arrest that person. It is called Citizen's arrest. Also, you have a right to remove trespassers from your property. Security guard is also entitled to these rights and he can arrest you if you don't comply. But before he arrests you for trespassing, he must warn you, ask you to leave and give you reasonable time to comply.
Posted by ryan
Most security guards do not have the authority to touch you. They are no different then mall security. The only thing they can do is tell you to come with them and wait while the call the police, weather you do that or not is your choice.
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[last edit 7/11/2008 1:31 AM by krot - edited 1 times]
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Azubi.UK
Location: UK / KSA
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 25 on 7/11/2008 3:48 PM >
| | | | Yes, tried and failed. I like to leg it if I can. After being chased by a rather aggressive security guard dubbed 'ginger bollocks' with a golf club, I don't really want to deal with the hassle of that all over again.
The 11th Commandment: Don't get caught! |
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NoSuchPerson
  
Stop, or I'll ask you again!
| | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 26 on 7/11/2008 5:58 PM >
| | | | Just a couple of corrections;
In order to satisfy CCC494 requirements for a Citizen's Arrest, you must witness an indictable act take place. Example would be theft or assault. This applies to anybody who isn't a Peace Officer.
A security guard however, is allowed to arrest "on or in relation" to property any person he/she finds committing a Criminal Offense - doesn't have to be Indictable. This is a big difference between a regular Citizen and a Security Guard.
Also, the CCC allows a Security Guard to "use as much force is as reasonably necessary to remove a trespasser". You bet this means physical contact. What this means is that if I am a Security Guard on whatever property and I have already identified myself as such and you are refusing to leave (or any other condition that satisfies you as a trespasser), I am legally justified to use as much physical force as necessary to remove you. If this means you fight back, I can fight back. Resisting the S/O's attempts to remove you is considered unprovoked assault, and now your trespassing fine just got bumped up to assault which is criminal.
As an S/O (or even a citizen), you have the right to search for weapons and means of escape. There is case law called "inevitable discovery" which means that if while searching for weapons or means of escape you happen across drugs, that search is legally justified because any reasonable person doing the same thing would happen upon it. So, when an S/O searches your backpack for weapons/means of escape and he finds stolen property from his site, guess what...
Yes, a S/O has to warn you (caution you) that you are trespassing. However, he does NOT have to caution you about committing a prohibited act on property, even if there is no sign indicating such.
For example, if I work in a shopping mall as a guard and I see someone skateboarding in the mall - there doesn't have to be a sign in order for me to remove you.
Remember, regardless of notice or any signs posted, if a S/O directs you to leave and you don't, that's arrestable - regardless of the reason why he/she is asking you to do so.
**All of the above is based on Ontario and Canada law, and could (probably) differs from where you are, so be sure to get familiar with the laws where you live.
Posted by krot
Security guards have no more rights than the owner of the property, which they are protecting. Security guards do not have police officers' rights.
But having said that, they DO have a right to a so called "CITIZEN's ARREST". Any person has a right to execute a citizen's arrest on somebody who is breaking the law. If it is withing common sense limits, of course. The only requirement is that you must NOT search that person and you are only allowed to remove tools or devices, which the arrested person can use to free himself, harm himself or someone else. Also, you must call police immediately after you perform citizen's arrest. This is the law in Ontario. So, it is NOT true that security guard has no right to touch you at all. For example, if you go to Loblaw's and see that a guy is beating an old lady, you have a right to stop and arrest that person. It is called Citizen's arrest. Also, you have a right to remove trespassers from your property. Security guard is also entitled to these rights and he can arrest you if you don't comply. But before he arrests you for trespassing, he must warn you, ask you to leave and give you reasonable time to comply.
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[last edit 7/11/2008 5:59 PM by NoSuchPerson - edited 1 times]
Unit calling radio say again? |
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Wilk
 
Location: NYC
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 28 on 7/11/2008 9:48 PM >
| | | | Posted by junkyard
Yeah, but I tossed him a cold one and my buddy had like $8 in singles he threw up in the air. He was so confused, caught the beer out of instinct I guess and stopped long enough to pick up the cash while we ran back the way we came. I'm sure it took him 2.4 seconds to figure out they were nothing but singles.....not even a fiver in there. But still, 8 bucks and a beer ain't a bad tip and you know he wasn't going to tell the bossman. You enjoy the cold brew while no one's looking and keep the money. It also makes a damn good story. So if nothing is broken or stolen, who the fuck is gonna know? Works like a charm.
Note: Does not work with warm beer. At least it wouldn't with me, so don't try it.
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Guys in the Strategic Beer Command have all the fun. jeez.....
Ready for liftoff
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Papa Mario
| | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 29 on 7/12/2008 3:08 AM >
|  | | | I have worked private security and university security at a variety of details. The standard procedures for us were to avoid all physical contact unless someone is in immediate danger. Though, I have had coworkers violate this and not severely repremanded. Some security officers (especialy campus or university security for big name schools) work rather closely with police and might be ballsy enough to chase you but in my experience the protocol would have only to follow to keep police updated on an individual'l location so a sworn officer could reprimand. Normally leaving the grounds/site/location/what ever would suffice in ditching the gaurd. Our main goal would be to get the individual to leave the premises. This is the midwest and pretty consistant at my places of employment.
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junkyard
Location: LaCrosse, WI
Gender: Male
Strategic Beer Command where the metal hits the meat.
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 30 on 7/15/2008 12:51 AM >
| | | | I will go out on a limb here and say that citizen's arrest is BS. You try and pull that shit on me. If you are not a duly sworn officer of the law. You get a beer for your troubles and I'm a ghost. No disrespect.....I just don't wanna stay. If you can keep up and tackle my ass, you deserve to keep me til the real cops arrive. Anything less is just a game, and a fun one if you like cold beer. 3rd rule of Beer Command is: Don't EVER let it get warm, no matter what the cost. If I have to share even with security to uphold the law, I'll do it for my fellow COmmandos. ANd mainly The Mouse, so I don't get dead.
I drink gasoline for breakfeast and beer for dinner!
Any problem can be licked with a case of beer and a few sticks of dynamite.
Strategic Beer Command ruling the desert since 1995 http://www.strategic-beer-command.com |
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NoSuchPerson
Stop, or I'll ask you again!
| | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 31 on 7/15/2008 1:07 AM >
|  | | | This is the thing. An arrest is an arrest. It doesn't matter if it is the Police, a Security Officer or a Citizen, the arrests have all the same power of law.
As such, you can be charged with resisting arrest, and all that other fun stuff, even if it is a citizens arrest.
Unit calling radio say again? |
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junkyard
Location: LaCrosse, WI
Gender: Male
Strategic Beer Command where the metal hits the meat.
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 32 on 7/15/2008 7:23 AM >
| | | | Then come arrest me. I'm waiting for the charges. It was some guy with brown hair and brown eyes.......Middle aged.
I drink gasoline for breakfeast and beer for dinner!
Any problem can be licked with a case of beer and a few sticks of dynamite.
Strategic Beer Command ruling the desert since 1995 http://www.strategic-beer-command.com |
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NoSuchPerson
Stop, or I'll ask you again!
| | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 33 on 7/15/2008 8:39 AM >
| | | | Lol, why would I do that? :p
I'm just saying - just because it may not be a Police Officer conducting the arrest doesn't make it any less of an arrest. A person is still legally allowed to use as much force as is necessary to affect the arrest, and is allowed to use force to defend against unprovoked assault (resisting arrest is considered assault, even if you don't hit the person).
Obviously a citizen probably doesn't have the same resources available to them as a Police Officer or even Security Guard, but still...
Unit calling radio say again? |
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flux
Location: North Carolina
Gender: Male
so many places... so little time...
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 34 on 7/15/2008 5:50 PM >
| | | | The best way is not to get caught. I've only run into a couple of people. Bums and owners. None of which have been hostile. I actually showed one guy my pictures and he told me to walk around all I wanted.  At the train station we went to we just kept walking and talking pictures like we didn't even see the guy and he never said a word to us.
Capturing God's beauty and mans decay. |
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BasementStyle
Location: Boston
Gender: Female
| | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 35 on 7/15/2008 10:13 PM >
| | | | I was in Taunton when I had my first security guard run-in. Me and a couple friends heard her coming too late and we dove into some bushes.... Not very large bushes, might I add.
She just kind of laughed and said, "Heeeeeeey girls!" Then politely told us to leave.
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junkyard
Location: LaCrosse, WI
Gender: Male
Strategic Beer Command where the metal hits the meat.
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 36 on 7/16/2008 2:12 AM >
| | | | I've read citizen's arrest laws too and find that it conflicts with other laws. If that were the case anyone getting in a bar fight would claim it was an arrest and get off scott free. It just doesn't happen that way. I could also see the arresting person going to jail for false imprisonment. That is also a law. But who really cares since security more than likely are more about chasing you off and not risking getting the boots put to them. They don't know who they are dealing with either.
I drink gasoline for breakfeast and beer for dinner!
Any problem can be licked with a case of beer and a few sticks of dynamite.
Strategic Beer Command ruling the desert since 1995 http://www.strategic-beer-command.com |
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NoSuchPerson
Stop, or I'll ask you again!
| | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 37 on 7/16/2008 3:21 AM >
| | | | 99 percent of the time that is all a guard wants.
It doesn't matter if I 'don't know who I'm dealing with'. If I get in trouble, I can push a button and have 5 or 6 other guys there within a minute. Depending on the site, some guards get the same level of self defence training as Police Officers. I know I can hold my own against someone bigger than me, I've had to do it a few times.
Someone who has the mindset of laying the boots to a guard is clearly not of sound character and more than likely has some past run-ins with the law. To quote a recent newspaper article where some security guards got into it with someone at a bar:
"Hopefully the bar patrol will learn his lesson and think twice before choosing to fight the person most likely to a) win and b) call the police".
Unit calling radio say again? |
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junkyard
Location: LaCrosse, WI
Gender: Male
Strategic Beer Command where the metal hits the meat.
| | | Re: Has a Security Guard Ever Tried to Detain You?
<Reply # 38 on 7/16/2008 3:57 AM >
| | | | Some scrappers and meth heads have indeed had past run ins with the law. Some security guys work alone, ran into one of those 2 weekends ago. Fighting isn't always the answer. I've noticed it's usually easier to ask someone to do something rather than using methods less favorable to them.
I drink gasoline for breakfeast and beer for dinner!
Any problem can be licked with a case of beer and a few sticks of dynamite.
Strategic Beer Command ruling the desert since 1995 http://www.strategic-beer-command.com |
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