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 KONG
      
Sus scrofa domestica
Location: Kingston, Ontario
Gender: Male
 |  | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 20 on 6/6/2007 9:56 PM >
|  | | | I think carrying burglary tools is much safer in terms of you being charged with a crime than carring pot, and we all know of explorers who do it all the time.
Cops treat people based on their observations. They are very judgemental. Women are innocent, long hair on men is trouble. Tattoos and cigarette must be real trouble. etc.. Camera on tripod, clean shaven, short hair, sober.. You ain't getting arrested.
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Nvr2loud
 
Man with the golden shoes
Location: Huntsville, Ontario
Gender: Male
| | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 21 on 6/7/2007 12:25 PM >
| | | | Posted by Jef
Call bull shit all you like, I know this is fact. I know this happened, as it happened to my brother. I saw the paper work, I was in the car when this happened.
You also have no idea of his record, which yes was the main reason why he was charged.
Thats ok if all you retards want to continue to carry your tool and continue to ask if its a tool and can I get into trouble. I cant wait to read your posts crying and bitching about it..... I will leave you a "I told you so"....
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Well, your brother had a really really really bad lawyer. The police can charge you with anything, that part is believeable, however, they must be able to prove your guilt in court. There is a piece of your story missing, regardless of past criminal record, your brother gave them a reason to convict him of possession of burglery tools for having a screwdriver in the car.... like maybe the loot sitting in the trunk, LOL
You can't be lost if you don't care where you are!
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Nvr2loud
Man with the golden shoes
Location: Huntsville, Ontario
Gender: Male
| | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 22 on 6/7/2007 12:29 PM >
| | | | I do agree that possession of tools or lights when arrested or questioned for tresspassing is not good. These tools can cause significant complications and may indeed get you charged with a criminal offence. If you need tools to enter, stash the tools and pick them up later. If you need a light, make it as small as possible. I try not to wear gloves, but sometimes that isn't a good idea, so be ready to toss the gloves in a heartbeat.
Jef, I agree with your opinions, just having trouble believing the conviction of your brother based on a screwdriver when no crime was committed. It is your obligation to prove your statement, not our obligation to disprove it.
You can't be lost if you don't care where you are!
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blackhawk
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Mission Control
UER newbie
| |  | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 23 on 6/7/2007 1:51 PM >
| | | | Posted by Nvr2loud
I do agree that possession of tools or lights when arrested or questioned for tresspassing is not good. These tools can cause significant complications and may indeed get you charged with a criminal offence. If you need tools to enter, stash the tools and pick them up later. If you need a light, make it as small as possible. I try not to wear gloves, but sometimes that isn't a good idea, so be ready to toss the gloves in a heartbeat.
Jef, I agree with your opinions, just having trouble believing the conviction of your brother based on a screwdriver when no crime was committed. It is your obligation to prove your statement, not our obligation to disprove it.
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Keep it simple... by "tossing" stuff you provide compelling evidence that you are engage in a criminal endeavor. You also increase your exposure many times too; never know whee an extra pair of eyes may be lurking.
Too many variables may it impossible to keep things in control; careful plans turn into nightmares quick. By deciding to B&E or such, you automatically increase your chances of having a really bad time. You decrease your margin for error too. Once a LEO thinks your dirty, they will lean on you hard, and some have a lot of resources at their disposal.
I really wouldn't go this far for a hobby, and if you do, avoid places where people live or board. I avoid active sites like the plague; the living are nothing but trouble. In the US, these are felony offense's too. You won't plea bargain a felony offense(s) down to a municipals one(s), and maybe not even to a misdemeanor level. Expect to pay at least $1.2K, and $5K is not uncommon for just legal defense in a criminal felony trial. You will receive jail time for a felony conviction many times too. Forget ever owning a gun in the US with a felony conviction too; it stays with you for the rest of your life.
Not worth it.
Just when I thought I was out... they pulled me back in.
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Nvr2loud
Man with the golden shoes
Location: Huntsville, Ontario
Gender: Male
| | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 24 on 6/7/2007 2:17 PM >
| | | | Posted by blackhawk
Keep it simple... by "tossing" stuff you provide compelling evidence that you are engage in a criminal endeavor. You also increase your exposure many times too; never know whee an extra pair of eyes may be lurking.
Too many variables may it impossible to keep things in control; careful plans turn into nightmares quick. By deciding to B&E or such, you automatically increase your chances of having a really bad time. You decrease your margin for error too. Once a LEO thinks your dirty, they will lean on you hard, and some have a lot of resources at their disposal.
I really wouldn't go this far for a hobby, and if you do, avoid places where people live or board. I avoid active sites like the plague; the living are nothing but trouble. In the US, these are felony offense's too. You won't plea bargain a felony offense(s) down to a municipals one(s), and maybe not even to a misdemeanor level. Expect to pay at least $1.2K, and $5K is not uncommon for just legal defense in a criminal felony trial. You will receive jail time for a felony conviction many times too. Forget ever owning a gun in the US with a felony conviction too; it stays with you for the rest of your life.
Not worth it.
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All the plans in the world can go to shit in a second, however I'm just saying carry as little as possible and be prepared to lose the stuff quickly. If a cop walks around the next corner and spots you, perhaps it ISN'T a good time to throw your gloves or lights away.... but if you're exploring an old building and the cops drive up to the front door, hide your stuff quickly and get out, that way if you are caught, you are caught without the stuff, and that is the simple truth, if you can lose it... do it.
You can't be lost if you don't care where you are!
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Jef
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Gender: Male
Hey Look at me....
| | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 25 on 6/7/2007 6:18 PM >
| | | | Posted by Nvr2loud
Well, your brother had a really really really bad lawyer. The police can charge you with anything, that part is believeable, however, they must be able to prove your guilt in court. There is a piece of your story missing, regardless of past criminal record, your brother gave them a reason to convict him of possession of burglery tools for having a screwdriver in the car.... like maybe the loot sitting in the trunk, LOL
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Nothing to do with having a bad lawyer or anything like that, he plead it out. AS for things being missing yes there is the types of crimes he had been previously charged with. That still does not excuse the fact that the police can charge you for having ANY FUCKING TOOL. Which is the point of this thread.
TOOLS CAN GET YOU CHARGED.... I dont care to debate my brother. I dont care to debate what happened to anyone in the past. This is the fucking rookie forum, and I was sick of seeing the goddamn fucking tool threads asking if they can get into trouble.
Fuck it for now on I saw let the fucking "newb", the posers, and whoever bring along their grappling hooks, bolt cuters, skrew drivers, and lockpicks all in one backpack.
We must also go out and meet the enemy before he reaches our shores. We must defeat him before he attacks us, before our cities are laid to waste.
William Lyon Mackenzie King, Prime Minister of Canada from 1921-1926, 1926-1930 and 1935-1948 |
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blackhawk
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Mission Control
UER newbie
| | | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 26 on 6/7/2007 6:38 PM >
| | | | Posted by Jef
Nothing to do with having a bad lawyer or anything like that, he plead it out. AS for things being missing yes there is the types of crimes he had been previously charged with. That still does not excuse the fact that the police can charge you for having ANY FUCKING TOOL. Which is the point of this thread.
TOOLS CAN GET YOU CHARGED.... I dont care to debate my brother. I dont care to debate what happened to anyone in the past. This is the fucking rookie forum, and I was sick of seeing the goddamn fucking tool threads asking if they can get into trouble.
Fuck it for now on I saw let the fucking "newb", the posers, and whoever bring along their grappling hooks, bolt cuters, skrew drivers, and lockpicks all in one backpack.
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This is one thing I can agree with you on Jef; any tools you bring increase the chances of being arrested, and/or increasing the severity of the charges.
They can easily turn a municipal offense into a felony.
Don't be so naive as to think you will outsmart/out maneuver the cops; they probably have more experience then most people here do at this sort of thing.
Most times tools are not needed anyway.
One more thing n00blets, posting your intentions of doing it on the web clearly shows intent.
Just when I thought I was out... they pulled me back in.
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Nvr2loud
Man with the golden shoes
Location: Huntsville, Ontario
Gender: Male
| | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 27 on 6/7/2007 8:00 PM >
| | | | Blackhawk and Jef,
I agree with both of you, only bring what is absolutely neccessary and don't bring things you are unwilling to throw away. I usually only bring my cameras and a flashlight, occasionally gloves and a dust mask, but those are throw away items anyway. I use cheap regular lose fitting work gloves, they can literally 'fall-off' my hands when I need them gone. No messing around with tight leather gloves, straps, velcro, ect.
My only point with Jef was I agree you can be charged with anything, but the charges must be proven. Your brother did not get convicted based on proof that the screwdriver was a burglary tool, he plead guilty therefore saying he had a burglary tool. I may be splitting hairs, but there is a big difference in just possessing a tool and having intent to use it for a crime.
So newbs, listen-up.... as these fine explorers have said many many times in this thread, any and all items taken along while trespassing could result in a charge of possession of burlary tools, therefore do not bring extra items because you think they are cool. Bring only things you need, stash them when not needed, and be prepared to throw away items quickly. If you are caught before you have a chance to throw away something, you better be very good at talking your way out of criminal charges, best of luck to everyone, be smart.
You can't be lost if you don't care where you are!
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Jef
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Gender: Male
Hey Look at me....
| | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 28 on 6/7/2007 9:12 PM >
| | | | Posted by Nvr2loud
So newbs, listen-up.... as these fine explorers have said many many times in this thread, any and all items taken along while trespassing could result in a charge of possession of burlary tools, therefore do not bring extra items because you think they are cool. Bring only things you need, stash them when not needed, and be prepared to throw away items quickly. If you are caught before you have a chance to throw away something, you better be very good at talking your way out of criminal charges, best of luck to everyone, be smart.
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Perfect.............
We must also go out and meet the enemy before he reaches our shores. We must defeat him before he attacks us, before our cities are laid to waste.
William Lyon Mackenzie King, Prime Minister of Canada from 1921-1926, 1926-1930 and 1935-1948 |
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Jennasaurus Rex
Location: East Texas
Gender: Female
RAWR
| | Re: Is it a tool?
<Reply # 29 on 9/4/2007 2:18 AM >
| | | | I found this on another thread on here and thought it might be useful...
Thanks to Nightskye for all this great info!!!!
http://208.68.90.1...urrpage=1&pp#post0
XOXO!!!
Jenni |
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