 |
|
|
UER Store
|
|
sweet UER decals:
|
|
|
|
Activity
|
|
896 online
Server Time:
2024-05-06 11:42:58
|
|
|
 Mr. Dork
 
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
Enter the Unknown
 |  |  | Doing Project on UE
< on 2/25/2013 3:39 PM >
|  | | | So I'm doing my senior project on UrbEx and, though I've explored many times before, I'm now worried about the legality of it. My parents are both retired cops, and they don't like that I do this, but they support me in a way I guess. I have taken photos at all the sites I go to with and without me in them. I was hoping to do a photo or video portion of my project with emphasis on the sites and the history behind them. I'm curious about a few things though.
1) Could I possibly be suspended for doing this project and/or not graduate(fail) due to it being on a potentially illegal activity.?
2) Could the photos or video be used to incriminate me if I am ever charged with trespassing?
3) I know this answer already, but should I contact property owners and law enforcement before exploring sites (ones that I have already been to multiple times) in order to be sure I won't be charged, even though all the areas I go to do not have No Trespassing signs?
They are either owned by the airport, the shopping centers nearby, or possibly the Federal Government still. I forgot the information I looked up about who the owners were, but it shall be easy to contact them if it should be necessary.
What do you guys think? I want to do this project and make it amazing so that people realize we aren't trying to get copper, drink beer and smoke weed, and draw all over walls. I want just a tiny bit of respect for our "hobby".
http://mr-dork.tumblr.com/
Posted by Skye_Ann
It's much easier to ask for forgiveness if you get caught, than to ask for permission. |
|
Abandoned not Forgotten
 
Location: Northern NJ
Gender: Male
| |  | | Re: Doing Project on UE
<Reply # 1 on 2/25/2013 5:09 PM >
| | | | Posted by Mr. Dork
I'm now worried about the legality of it.
|
The first piece of advice I can give you is never ever seek legal advice on an internet forum. Unless there is a lawyer in the house with the credentials to prove it, I would take anyones advice with more than a grain of salt. Assume that we are all monkeys that have no idea what we're talking about. So below are my monkey OPINIONS roughly based on things I've heard, read or just came up with on my own.
Posted by Mr. Dork
1) Could I possibly be suspended for doing this project and/or not graduate(fail) due to it being on a potentially illegal activity.?
|
That's totally up to your school, your teacher(s) and its administration. What I would do in your shoes, is skip the entire trespassing bit in your presentation. If the question comes up - avoid it or say do not explore private property without permission and leave it at that. Concentrate more on the history of places and nice pictures instead of how you get into places.
Posted by Mr. Dork
2) Could the photos or video be used to incriminate me if I am ever charged with trespassing?
|
If you were involved in some serious vandalism / arson / etc., I could see the potential for your photos and videos being used as evidence. It would require some serious detective work on behalf of the court to confiscate your computer and find the original photos with EXIF data linking them to your camera. Even though it is your camera, they would probably have to prove that you actually took those specific photos with your specific camera. I'm not sure how they would achieve that without you being in any of the photos.
Posted by Mr. Dork
3) I know this answer already, but should I contact property owners and law enforcement before exploring sites (ones that I have already been to multiple times) in order to be sure I won't be charged, even though all the areas I go to do not have No Trespassing signs?
|
If you've already been in there - what's the point? Alerting owners about the potential of explorers entering is detrimental to the UE community and could result in the owner tightening up on security. At the same time, you might end up incriminating yourself. A big part of UE is waiting - waiting for locations to become accessible. I would only contact a property owner if I knew there was absolutely no other way for me to get inside - now or anytime in the future.
Also regarding asking permission I'll quote Skye_Ann from this thread:
Posted by Skye_Ann
It's much easier to ask for forgiveness if you get caught, than to ask for permission.
|
...and Steed's reply from the same thread:
Posted by Steed
The problem with asking for permission is if you get a no, then you really should give up entirely, because if you're caught after being refused access, that's a pretty bad position. I'll take my chances with asking for forgiveness.
|
[last edit 2/25/2013 5:25 PM by Abandoned not Forgotten - edited 6 times]
Abandoned not Forgotten (Under Construction)
Flickr | YouTube | Facebook
Canon T4i | Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8 | Canon 50mm f/1.8 II | Manfrotto 190XPROB |
|
CatAndTie
Location: Southeastern PA
Gender: Male
LifeInDecay. com
| | | Re: Doing Project on UE
<Reply # 2 on 2/25/2013 5:33 PM >
| | | | This has been a topic discussed many times in the past and will always need to be addressed. I've always found it to be a rather gray area regarding legalities.
Here's my understanding (and somebody please correct any flaws in this):
Technically if the wrong person sees a picture of their facility they could press charges. But is it worth the legal battle? The only thing they potentially would have on you is trespassing... they couldn't prove you stole anything, burned anything, vandalised, or even that you were involved with breaking and entering. They would also, as Abandoned Not Forgotten said, need to do extensive research and detective work to prove it was even you who took those pictures/video, when they were taken, and if they were even taken at the specific facility in question.
As for your school, that could be a different story. Ask your teacher what they think. I know the school I went to always encouraged pushing boundaries, but other schools might frown upon such things.
Also, what do you retired cop parents say about it? Maybe they know some lawyers that might be able to shed some light on this topic... We actually interviewed a lawyer during our travels, who definitely agreed it was a very gray area (granted this wasn't really his topic of interest). It can happen, but most likely would not. Unless you are filming yourselves smashing stuff and vandalising things, which I assume you are not.
I think I have also heard at least in the US or certain states there is a time frame that charges for trespassing have to be filed (within a year or two of it occurring), and if this is true, then they very well could have a hell of a time proving when the incident occurred. (This one I'm more unsure of, so somebody please verify or correct this!!)
Again, as ANF said, take all this advice with a grain of salt. And if you do get legal advice, please inform the rest of us!
"Man cannot discover new oceans unless he has the courage to lose sight of the shore." - Andre Gide |
|
SuchundFind
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Gender: Male
| | Re: Doing Project on UE
<Reply # 3 on 2/25/2013 6:57 PM >
| | | | Now lets take it from a different standpoint. A property owner must make sure that nobody can get in their building and has to do this with necessary means.
So if someone would press charges because they saw you on a picture, and you can prove there was just an open door and I wanted to check if children were in there, this could help you to get out of the worst part. But on the same page if you had to jump over a 6 foot fence, climb into the 2nd story window and than take a picture of yourself, you are in trouble.
So it always can go in both direction, you just need a good lawyer, if you need one I know one in San Antonio.
|
|
Asher0719
Location: MSP
Gender: Female
The World Abandoned
| | Re: Doing Project on UE
<Reply # 4 on 2/25/2013 7:15 PM >
| | | | I think it's pretty cool that you're doing a project on UE for school, but I would definitely tell you to be cautious. While doing the project I wouldn't stress the legal issues that come with our hobby (unless, of course, that's what the project is about). If you're going to include photos I would avoid any with people in them (at least people facing the camera), especially pictures of yourself. I know you can blur faces or black bar them, but in some ways that's telling people your hobby is illegal without saying a word. I would also avoid using the names of sites, or featuring photos that make the sites obvious to viewers (signs, extremely familiar facades). While I doubt you could be suspended or even arrested there is a chance that your teacher may become concerned for your safety and report it to a school authority who may take it a step further. Just be careful and cover your tracks. Double check your work and then double check it again just to make sure you don't leave any loopholes that could bite you in the ass.
~Asher |
|
SuchundFind
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Gender: Male
| | Re: Doing Project on UE
<Reply # 5 on 2/25/2013 7:38 PM >
| | | | Did you get this project approved in the first place?
|
|
Mr. Dork
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
Enter the Unknown
| | | Re: Doing Project on UE
<Reply # 6 on 2/25/2013 10:07 PM >
| | | | My parents just don't want me to be arrested. They are for me exploring, but they want me safe. As for the school, I had to ask for approval, and they 99.9% approve every topic proposed for this project, including alcohol, weed, smoking, and underage sex. So, with me pushing it as art, they look at the legality part as just a factor in my way, or so I hope. My teacher in charge of this project is all for it. Apparently no one in the history of the school has done this topic. That's breaking new ground in my community on this subject I guess. Other teachers I've also told have shared stories and are excited to see what I do with this project. I haven't talked to any administrators yet or the principal(which I happen to be good friends with), but I have approval currently of my teachers, and most likely the board in charge of the whole project anyway.
Would having my face in the camera (while videoing) to explain a few facts about the site before we visit it be dangerous, you suppose? No proof I actually entered the site, as you said they have no idea who is recording and everything.
http://mr-dork.tumblr.com/
Posted by Skye_Ann
It's much easier to ask for forgiveness if you get caught, than to ask for permission. |
|
AnAppleSnail
 
Location: Charlotte, NC
Gender: Male
ALL the flashlights!
| | | | Re: Doing Project on UE
<Reply # 7 on 2/26/2013 3:10 AM >
| | | | Why do you care so much about the opinions of strangers to your hobby?
Show art. Discuss physical dangers of old buildings and” backstage” area like drains and elevator shafts. I've learned a lot about buildings from exploring. And how to evaluate floors...
Achievement Unlocked
|
|
|
|
All content and images copyright © 2002-2024 UER.CA and respective creators. Graphical Design by Crossfire.
To contact webmaster, or click to email with problems or other questions about this site:
UER CONTACT
View Terms of Service |
View Privacy Policy |
Server colocation provided by Beanfield
This page was generated for you in 125 milliseconds. Since June 23, 2002, a total of 740803016 pages have been generated.
|
|
