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UER Mobile > UE Tutorials, Lessons, and Useful Info > Boat Advice/Discussion (Viewed 3217 times)

post by Herm   |  | 
Boat Advice/Discussion
< on 7/2/2015 1:04 PM >

After recently renting a canoe, I've decided I need a boat of my own. It will be able to be operated solo and used for a variety of inland water uses to include rivers, lakes, and exploring drain outfalls. For those of you who own or have explored with boats, what types do you have, features you like, features you don't like, tips, essential accessories,etc...?


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post by DJ Craig   |  | Moderator

Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 1 on 7/2/2015 5:03 PM >

Not a canoe at all, but I own about 10 of these:
http://www.walmart...able-Boat/10928135

They don't last very long - they will start to leak air after a few uses depending on how gently you treat them. But at that price, you can't go wrong.


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post by dodger   |  | 
Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 2 on 7/2/2015 10:19 PM >

The advantage of an inflatable is that you can use them for float outs as well. (i.e. you pack it deflated with you as you enter through a grill/manhole etc and you inflate it when you're underground and float out to the river, harbour, etc. Also depending on the security situation at the exit, it's much easier to leg it with an inflatable than with a canoe/kayak!


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post by Ganesha   |  | Former Moderator

Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 3 on 7/3/2015 12:46 AM >

I've had a sea kayak for years, but I've never explored with it. I've seen some situations where a water approach would circumvent a fence; they often end at the waterline. A kayak can get me close to docks and ships in a way I can't do on foot.

A one-person sea kayak runs 11 - 16 feet long, and weighs 35-45 pounds. So it's a two-person job to carry it and put it on your car, tho some folks manage by putting the cockpit over one shoulder. It's a bad idea to go boating alone anyway. In fact kayaking is a risky-enough sport that investing in a class that includes self-rescue is a good idea. It's tricky to get yourself back inside a sea kayak and the water back out if you roll it.

A kayak is easier to steer than a canoe, and is good if the water's going to be turbulent; with a skirt you can take a wave up to your chest.

A canoe can carry more stuff. It weighs less, because it has no top deck. It looks more stable; but after years of kayaking I feel top-heavy and insecure in a canoe. A canoe is a bitch to steer in a straight line, and it's hard to imagine going solo in one.

A river kayak might be a good compromise for exploring. I've tried an inflatable river kayak and it was adequate, not as steady or speedy as a sea kayak, but fun to slither down rapids in.

Whatever craft you choose, wear a flotation vest to stay alive.


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post by Ganesha   |  | Former Moderator

Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 4 on 7/3/2015 1:21 AM >

Kayak features and gear (some apply to canoes too):

1. Hull shape (kayak and canoe). Wide, flat bottom makes for stability but tubby steering. Narrow, pointy bottom makes for good tracking. Typically you'll see lateral bulges on the sides; they give "secondary stability," meaning that the craft will bob around and tip some, but the closer it approaches capsizing the more it resists it. A longer kayak tracks better and is faster. This won't matter if you're just crossing a pond.

2. Straps. The ones behind the cockpit are crucial, because you'll need them for self-rescue. Front straps within reach of the cockpit are where you put stuff you'll use while in the kayak. Other straps are nice but not much use unless you're on shore. A good habit is to attach every piece of gear to your boat or yourself (this goes for canoes too). Kayaks with rudders have cables inside them to which you can also attach gear.

3. Seat. Your butt and your feet transmit your paddling force to the hull, so this arrangement needs to be secure and comfortable. They say you don't sit in a kayak, you wear it. You should be able to brace your knees against the underside of the top deck with your feet on footrests or rudder-controls and be one with the hull, able to rock it with your hips and knees. Adjust the distance of the footrests/rudder controls while sitting in the kayak on the beach (difficult to do on the water). I have a bony butt so I use a Thermarest cushion; that's part of my fitting process. The back of the seat should be adjustable. Sit in a kayak before you buy it. Some have cockpits so small that I can't get my legs and butt in at the same time.

4. Flotation. A kayak with front and rear bulkheads is safest, and you can carry stuff in those "holds" and keep it dry. Hatches should be watertight. Cheaper/lighter boats have just a rear bulkhead and a big inflatable bladder stuffed into the bow. These are harder to get water out of during a rescue; the bladder sometimes pops out of the cockpit.

5. Rudder. Larger kayaks have a rudder you control with your feet. It's easy to get dependent on it; it adds weight and is something to wear out or break. I bought a new kayak without one, and I don't miss it. A skeg is like a rudder, but is just a fin; it's for resisting a side-wind and improving tracking.

Gear:
FLOTATION VEST
double-bladed featherable paddle whose length suits your height and reach
seat cushion?
paddle float for self-rescue (take a class)
skirt for rough water
hand pump for water-fights or rescue
cable lock; those made for kayaks have a loop at each end to slip over the bow/stern
bow line for tying up, towing
dry bag for things you must keep dry; unfortunately we've found them undependable



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post by tick   |  | 
Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 5 on 7/5/2015 3:22 AM >

For a canoe that you'd be loading & carrying yourself, I HIGHLY recommend one made of Royalex. It's worth spending the extra cash to save a lot of weight.

I've seen great deals on Craiglist... I bought an Old Town Appalachian off of Craigslist for $500 (it retails for $1800). It had only been in the water once!

You'll need a PFD, at least one paddle (I keep a spare strapped to the thwarts, because nobody wants to be *that guy* who loses his only paddle), and a dry bag.


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post by Cracked   |  | 
Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 6 on 7/8/2015 4:48 PM >

I've used inflatables for a few explores. The advice I would give is go for a two man, as the one man inflatables are definitely on the dodgey side as far as rigidity and load bearing goes. And get a tri-hulled one (with three inflating areas). Once in a very tight tunnel (in the Paris catacombs) I had to deflate the outer hull, with myself and my wife in the boat, in order to fit through the passage. The two other hulls were enough to keep us afloat. if you damage or rip a section, it's not the end of the world that way. Carry emergency patches as well, just in case.


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post by terapr0   |  | 
Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 7 on 7/11/2015 9:02 PM >

We've got too many boats.... a 24ft Grady White center console with a 300hp V6 Verado outboard, a 21ft princecraft pontoon with a 40hp 4-stroke, an 18ft Nordique bowrider with a 90hp 4-stroke, a 12.5ft boston whaler with a 30hp 4-stroke, an old tin boat with an equally old (although super reliable) 9.9hp 2-stroke, two Clearwater Designs sea kayaks (one of them is a St. Lawrence model and I forget the other), an old cedar strip canoe, a Kevlar canoe (can't remember the brand) and a royalex Nova Craft canoe. They all serve different purposes, although for exploring I'd likely prefer the little boston whaler (fast, "unsinkable", decent capacity, great in rough water and able to get in shallow spots) or the canoes. The kayaks are great but you can't carry a ton of stuff (and what you can carry is stashed away inside and difficult to access on the fly) and they're pretty unstable when you're trying to get in or out in rough water). I've never used an inflatable pack raft but I'm told they're quite good and surprisingly durable if you spend the $$$ on a reputable brand.

As a general rule though I'd say that boats are horrible, horrible money pits. Everything about them is expensive, depending on where you live you can only enjoy them a few months of the year and it always seems like there's SOMETHING to fix/replace. We've got the bowrider up for sale and will likely be trimming down a few others in the coming years. They're fun, but unless you're totally passionate about boating, probably not worth the time / energy / money. And if you're going to buy one, buy something new or at least in good shape. Old boats are cheap as dirt for a reason. Unless you're retired with loads of time on your hands, the idea of "fixing up" an old boat is totally stupid and not worth the effort. If I had a nickel for every unfinished "project" boat I've seen started and never finished I could buy myself a case of hot-pockets.
Just my $0.02

[last edit 7/11/2015 9:08 PM by terapr0 - edited 2 times]

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post by terapr0   |  | 
Re: Boat Advice/Discussion
<Reply # 8 on 7/11/2015 9:17 PM >

Posted by Ganesha
It looks more stable; but after years of kayaking I feel top-heavy and insecure in a canoe. A canoe is a bitch to steer in a straight line, and it's hard to imagine going solo in one.


haha funny you say that. I've got far more canoeing experience than I do kayaking, and I feel the exact opposite. I have a hard time steering a kayak in a straight line and feel that I'm too top heavy. I guess it all comes down to personal experience in one vs. the other, although kayaks ARE definitely better suited for rough water than canoes. I try and do at least 1 or 2 whitewater canoe trips every year, and the point at which we have to portage is much tamer than someone in a whitewater kayak. I think generally speaking canoes max out in class III rapids, whereas there are lots of nutbars running insane class V stuff in those specialized river kayaks.



[last edit 7/11/2015 9:18 PM by terapr0 - edited 1 times]

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