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UER Forum > Archived UE Main > Meet up, break in (Viewed 7018 times)
DjMalign 


Location: Fort Collins, CO
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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 60 on 6/6/2011 4:15 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Tron, you obviously don't get the fact that urban explorers are an elite group of criminals who are being watched very closely. Everytime a board breaks the cops raid one of our hideouts.

I hate all of you
BeowulfBrower 


Location: Mendota, IL
Gender: Male


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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 61 on 6/6/2011 4:19 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
When did we get hideouts?!

Is that snow or asbestos?
DjMalign 


Location: Fort Collins, CO
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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 62 on 6/6/2011 5:02 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
when you get your one year badge of honor and glory

I hate all of you
rob.i.am 


Gender: Male


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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 63 on 6/6/2011 5:04 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Posted by DjMalign
Tron, you obviously don't get the fact that urban explorers are an elite group of criminals who are being watched very closely. Everytime a board breaks the cops raid one of our hideouts.


Post of the day

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rob666/
Jester 


Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
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Always just out of sight...

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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 64 on 6/6/2011 8:35 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Posted by DjMalign
Tron, you obviously don't get the fact that urban explorers are an elite group of criminals who are being watched very closely. Everytime a board breaks the cops raid one of our hideouts.


As helpful as that was...

You just have to have the luck of running into one cop or guard that read some article about dumb-asses that smash into places and take anything interesting to fuck up your day. People's views of what they don't understand come from the media. If they've read that explorers are thieves, then thats what you are to them, and thats how you'll be treated, despite all the "look at my camera, I'm a photographer" crap.

On the other hand, if you get caught by someone who has read a positive story, high lighting the "we won't damage or take anything" aspect, you're automatically in a better position to avoid any real problems.

How many times have you mentioned something about exploring to a person and they've heard of it? happens plenty. They saw a story or read a story in a paper about it. It's no different for guards and cops, they read newspapers and watch the news too. No matter what the odds, eventually someone is going to be in a situation where the guard or cop's existing view on the hobby is going to effect the outcome of things.

It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf.
DjMalign 


Location: Fort Collins, CO
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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 65 on 6/6/2011 11:16 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
That's a bunch of theoretical nonsense.

The fact is that each location has its own larger history outside the exploring scene. Sure, it is possible that someone will read a good article on UE and happen to be guarding something of little to no value. Get caught in the subways or a state hospital where guards are getting sick and tired of telling people to stay out? A story in the vague haze of internet or local media won't matter.

All media attention does is give the explorers involved a sense of momentary celebrity, it doesn't mean jack shit for the hobby, people have attention spans that can be measured in nanoseconds.

I hate all of you
DottedWithHearts 


Location: Mendota, Illinois
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The Pictures In Her Mind Arose And Began To Breathe

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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 66 on 6/7/2011 2:01 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Posted by BeowulfBrower

Well you see, when a girl loves a girl very much
They make babies
NOW YOU KNOW


And upon realising after a few hundred goes that it's biologically impossible without scientific intervention, we settle on adopting a new chihuahua.

You said "I'm as constant as the Northern Star,"
and to myself I whispered 'Always in the dark.'
Breach 


Location: Louisville, KY
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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 67 on 6/7/2011 2:09 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
^^^ +100!!

"I set the bar high, it makes it easier to sneak under." -J.D. Jenkins
tunnelbug 


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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 68 on 6/7/2011 6:56 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
I always love referring to this article, because the article itself was done with "militaristic precision." : The Art of Urban Exploration

Reporters can be your best ally; they can also be your worst enemy. Make use of them if you want people to understand what you do. If you don't care, then that's your prerogative, but beware that Americans are vastly undereducated about their built environment, and I believe it's our moral duty to help teach them.

Crowbar talk is nonsensical, but it appears this was done with good intentions. I hope we can learn from these mistakes. Adieu.

Bearings: A Geographer's Blog

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Jester 


Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male


Always just out of sight...

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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 69 on 6/7/2011 10:10 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Posted by DjMalign
That's a bunch of theoretical nonsense.

The fact is that each location has its own larger history outside the exploring scene. Sure, it is possible that someone will read a good article on UE and happen to be guarding something of little to no value. Get caught in the subways or a state hospital where guards are getting sick and tired of telling people to stay out? A story in the vague haze of internet or local media won't matter.

All media attention does is give the explorers involved a sense of momentary celebrity, it doesn't mean jack shit for the hobby, people have attention spans that can be measured in nanoseconds.


Nice way to counter by simply using your own theoretical nonsense.

Your view is short sighted, the typical "it hasn't happened to me yet, so it can't happen".

People are going to give interviews, and people in any walk of life could read/see those interviews. Every person's view is shaped by things they see, read, and experience, and you don't know when one of those experiences is going to benefit you or work completely against you.

It's one of those lessons in life a lot of people don't learn until it actually smacks them in the face and disrupts their belief that nothing they do can have a repercussion.

I know from experience, being contacted by law enforcement that the well established ethics of what I have done played a big role in that interaction, even down to the officer giving me tips on a place. You can believe it can never matter all you want, but some of us have learned from experience that it can.

It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf.
DjMalign 


Location: Fort Collins, CO
Gender: Male


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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 70 on 6/7/2011 3:13 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Whatever, believe that everything is all about you if you want. Fact remains that most of the time security will choose to do their job than trust a stranger who will claim "i'm an explorer". Sure, there might be a slight chance that your scenario CAN happen, but the world is a much more dynamic and chaotic place than to be influenced by a single article about some people running around abandoned spaces.

In other words, people need to get the fuck over themselves.

EDIT: To make it clear, it is how your ability to deal with law enforcement that decides your fate, not an article. The power of the media in the case of exploration is a non-issue, if you look like bin laden's son while exploring subway tunnels and flip off reporters, no ue article will save you
[last edit 6/7/2011 3:16 PM by DjMalign - edited 1 times]

I hate all of you
Jester 


Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male


Always just out of sight...

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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 71 on 6/7/2011 6:44 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Posted by DjMalign
Whatever, believe that everything is all about you if you want.


In other words, people need to get the fuck over themselves.


Completely misinterpreting what I said.

It isn't all about me or any of us, it is the simple logic which says very action has a reaction. If a person's perception of you is already shaped before they encounter you, it WILL effect how they react to you. Maybe it's a 1% chance on the unlucky day you get caught, that the person knows about the hobby, and what they know will probably have been learned from an interview by someone here. I'd much rather have that small chance be that the person has the view that "explorers are harmless, just wanting some pictures" instead of "breaking in and taking shit".



Posted by DjMalign
EDIT: To make it clear, it is how your ability to deal with law enforcement that decides your fate, not an article. The power of the media in the case of exploration is a non-issue, if you look like bin laden's son while exploring subway tunnels and flip off reporters, no ue article will save you


Of course every situation is different, and plain stupidity in almost any situation will go badly.

It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf.
DjMalign 


Location: Fort Collins, CO
Gender: Male


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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 72 on 6/7/2011 6:58 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Posted by Jester
I'd much rather have that small chance be that the person has the view that "explorers are harmless, just wanting some pictures" instead of "breaking in and taking shit".


Alright, maybe I was being a little harsh in my last post, but your logic is flawed because you are assuming that cops or security are willing to take your word at face value. If they've had enough encounters, they know that everyone claims innocence. I haven't been caught often, but when I have i've only been let go once they could ascertain that I am not a criminal by searching through my stuff.

What i'm saying is that an article will have very little to no impact on how they conduct themselves when they catch you. Issues such as procedure, precedent, and the demeanor of the individual will have a greater impact on how they treat you as a trespasser.

Any article highlighting what we do is bad for exploration, because it is someone's job to keep us out of those places, whether or not it is in a "good" or "bad" light. We have a very specific outlook on the hobby that some deem "positive", but the fact remains that anyone coming to this site to research after reading about UE will see threads where people are bragging about escaping security.

In other words, stop pretending that we're not petty criminals according to law and move on from this topic which is rehashed 3 times a year.
[last edit 6/7/2011 6:59 PM by DjMalign - edited 1 times]

I hate all of you
Jester 


Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male


Always just out of sight...

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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 73 on 6/8/2011 2:23 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Posted by DjMalign

In other words, stop pretending that we're not petty criminals according to law and move on from this topic which is rehashed 3 times a year.


Thats the thing, we are PETTY criminals, barely worthy of notice if all you do is harmlessly trespass causing no damage or theft. But if someone's view is that you aren't petty, but are a destructive criminal, a more serious problem, then you can be starting off at a disadvantage, reducing or eliminating any hope of walking away with a warning.

I simply know from firsthand experience that the reputation of what you do can make a big difference. Maybe someday you'll experience an event that shows you, maybe not, but some people will.

It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf.
Eschaton 


Location: Western NC
Gender: Male


Entry: Eschaton (es-kuh-tawn) noun | end of time, climax of history | Etymology: Greek for 'last'

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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 74 on 6/8/2011 2:44 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Thanks for your insight, Jester. I agree, I think if anyone wants to keep this hobby one that is free and accessible to all, then we all should recognize that we have at least slight responsibility in how the rest of the world sees it.
I'm sure I'm not the only one here who values Ninjy's words on the subject; I know I found great inspiration from reading "No Disclaimer" (another reason this article makes me sick is how grossly misportrayed Ninjy is, and how the author put my words in his mouth), wherein he describes a difference between "illegal" and "immoral".
If we don't represent ourselves properly when the reporters come calling as photographers and historians who mean no harm, as just regular people with a few offbeat interests, and not criminals, then we quickly find ourselves lumped in with the taggers, scrappers, and arsonists. Soon enough, we'll all have prices on our heads, just out of guilt by association. Call it paranoia or what have you, but if we all have the same passive attitude about it, I wouldn't be surprised if it goes that far.
[last edit 6/8/2011 2:45 AM by Eschaton - edited 1 times]

Ars Gratia Adventuris
Relocate 


Location: nunyabiz
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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 75 on 6/8/2011 4:17 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Overall, It seems like a negative thing that the article was poorly written/worded, but I'm sure it wont affect anyone outside of Kentucky.

BUT it is fucked up that they would do this article after Eschaton didn't approve(they should have at least left him out entirely)

I personally think the less publicity that we have, the better...

To fail in what you've yet to achieve is more the spirit of exploration than to make no attempt at all.
-Neil deGrasse Tyson
JavaSpartan 


Location: Chicago




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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 76 on 6/8/2011 4:19 AM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
Another view talking about the polarization of urban explorers...also talks about how corporations take advantage of the culture.

http://www.domuswe...urban-exploration/

I think it is interesting that the author goes into the fact that corporations seek to commodify the urban exploration culture. Shoes, apps, etc. I guess this could be considered another reason why media attention is a negative in that it allows us to be taken advantage of by people who want to make money. Another thing that he mentions is the scare that authorities and owners have concerning the breaches in their security. All of what we were mentioning in this post.
[last edit 6/8/2011 4:31 AM by JavaSpartan - edited 1 times]

petticat 


Location: Milwaukee, WI
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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 77 on 6/8/2011 1:31 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
^ this article is the exact opposite of the one this thread is about. it's experienced and not amateur, well-written, states a clear point and isn't as "touristy" as the one this thread is about.

We're all just trapped between the stippled earth and the stubbled sky.
team haymaker 


Location: Burlington, Ontario
Gender: Male




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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 78 on 6/8/2011 4:29 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
this entire thread makes me laugh.
obviously names of specific people and places should have been left out.
but when it comes to talk about crowbars being used by explorers is the reporter really that far off? theres are plenty that will break into places. there is also plenty that wont.
either way you look at it, the article sucked, names were used that shouldnt have been, and that reporter wont last long writing like a 7 year old

BeowulfBrower 


Location: Mendota, IL
Gender: Male


Profession Tetanus Shot Receiver

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Re: Meet up, break in
<Reply # 79 on 6/8/2011 4:41 PM >
Posted on Forum: UER Forum
 
You know, I think it should be noted Panda and Dante don't carry a crowbar
Only Eschaton does, and he wasn't with them

Is that snow or asbestos?
UER Forum > Archived UE Main > Meet up, break in (Viewed 7018 times)
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