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 CMH
 
Gender: Male
 |  | Legality of boating in the city?
< on 9/20/2003 2:47 PM >
|  | | | Here's the plan: In a few weeks 3 of us are heading up to a nearby city bearing flashlights, cameras... and an aluminum boat. Those little pond fishing kind. This city has large creeks that crisscross it, and we want to boat down these creeks and find outfalls. Sometimes the creeks are visible from roads, sometimes they are just in forests. Either way, I'm sure several hundred people will end up seeing us in the course of a few hours. Does anyone know the general legality of boating in the creek? I can't imagine just being tossed in jail, but I could see the cops not liking that kind of thing.
Sorry to ask such a general and Googleable question, but I have no clue where to start searching.
"It's funnier that way." |
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Jester
Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male
Always just out of sight...
| |  | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 1 on 9/20/2003 7:15 PM >
|  | | | I've never seen any laws anywhere I've been that said you couldn't boat in a public waterway...
It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. |
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sidvicious
Location: Cowedge, Kansas
Gender: Male
We subsist to learn, because through learning, we grow.
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 2 on 9/21/2003 1:44 AM >
| | | | hmm, well. i'd say just make sure your boat is registered for the waterways.
but, the only way to really, really know for sure is to call the city and ask.
Commiting crimes with no remorse
As good as gold now an evil force |
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ProductOfDetroit
 
Location: Detroit/Troy
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 3 on 9/21/2003 3:15 AM >
|  | | | I've actually done that before here in Michigan. No one said anything though, a ton of people saw us but didn't do anything about it. I think you'll be fine. Isn't there somesort of a law that states that, water can't be owned, so as long as your in the water your on public property? So i guess that parts cool, but we used one of those blow up rafts from K-Mart, so it might be different. Good luck
http://www.flickr.com/photos/product34/ |
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nakigara
Location: ca desert
Gender: Male
| |  | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 4 on 9/22/2003 5:21 AM >
| | | | you should be able to find some sorta searchable database of laws and codes and such, i know there is a california one linked to the state's website.
anyways, if you can find one of those, do a search for water or boat(though youll probabally get lots of wierd regs about restaurants and vehicle construction or something)
also, even if your allowed there, you may get hit on wierd things like having lifevests for everyone, etc
but i think your right, youll probabally be warned first.
yogurt and beer. mmmm...... |
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IUSSA
This member has been banned
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 5 on 9/22/2003 1:15 PM >
| | | | I'm in Mass, it might be different for other states, but it's legal to boat in any public waterway. Some places are offlimits like reservoirs. Creeks should be okay, canals might be ownable by whoever built them or owns the land. Some places might have wierd laws, one reservoir here we can't kayak on, but you can bring a fishing boat on it as long as you're fishing . . the law for most water here is, if you have a motor you have to register it! No motor = no need to register it . . so rafts, kayaks and canoes are fine to put in anywhere you want, as long as you're all wearing life jackets nobody can do much to you. I kayak all the time here, go up into the drain here and never wear life jackets and nobody ever bothers me, most people who see you won't even notice you, just another boat. We don't have many rafters here so someone might notice a raft full of kids with no life jackets.
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Chainsaw
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Underground, Colorado
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 6 on 9/22/2003 4:32 PM >
| | | | From my old scouting days I know about the "Free Waterways Act of 1819" or some such thing - you might be able to google out some answers - but there is a federal law that prohibits local governments from interfering with your ability to access a waterway - basically it's a trade agreement to keep some towns from stopping river traffic - your local kayak shop/club will probably have a nut or two sitting in the back room that will rant about your right to go wherever you want to in a boat at great length.
So, if the rent-a-cops or regular-cops give you any grief explain to them that federal law requires they not restrict boat traffic on their waterways and to leave you the hell alone - and just paddle away...what's he gonna do? Swim?
Quid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
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Chainsaw
This member has been banned. See the banlist for more information.
Location: Underground, Colorado
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 7 on 9/22/2003 4:38 PM >
| | | | American white-water has broken down the rules by state pretty well here:
http://www.americanwhitewater.org/access/navigability.htm
Quid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
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Jester
Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male
Always just out of sight...
| | | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 8 on 9/22/2003 4:39 PM >
| | | | I used to live on a boat, and have never heard of any laws stopping a person from using a non-powered boat anywhere (except private property I suppose). I sincerely doubt anyone anywhere would give you any kind of hassle about it... I used to paddle all over the place...
It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. |
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MacGyver
Location: St Paul, Minnesota
Gender: Male
"Someone go find me a paperclip, a D-cell battery, and a cheese grater"
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 9 on 9/22/2003 4:48 PM >
| | | | now what about paddling your canoe/raft from the public unrestricted waterway into, say, a drain outfall. Any thoughts on legality of that? It's still water, in fact it's the exact same water that you would be boating on if you stayed in the public waterway a little longer. I don't see why you shouldn't be able to boat in drains.
Like a fiend with his dope / a drunkard his wine / a man will have lust for the lure of the mine
"If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent." |
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nakigara
Location: ca desert
Gender: Male
| | | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 10 on 9/22/2003 8:38 PM >
| | | | id just go ahead and go for it, people might say somehting, but they arent going to see you once your in the tunnel, and if some one actually swims after you or something, just play dumb, like your friend told you this is where the entrance to the 'canoe parking' is, or your trying to get across the street. i dont think they would do much other then yell at you to get out of there/dont do that again, etc.
theres a lot of really stupid people in the world, so sometimes it makes a pretty easy disguise. ive gotten out of quite a bit of trouble(none of it ue related) by just playing dumb. kinda comes naturally to me, i guess 
yogurt and beer. mmmm...... |
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CMH
Gender: Male
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 11 on 9/23/2003 12:27 AM >
| | | | Wow, thanks for the replies guys. Now it seems like a dumb question, but at the time I was pretty unsure. Very good link Chainsaw, thanks. That link provides information on legality of boating streams for every state. Talk about right on the money.
The cops in this city aren't as nutty as the ones in my home town. The ones in my home town are bullies, and these are more professional police. In my town, the cops would use it as an excuse to detain you for possible drug smuggling. :p
And if I was still a minor, they would call my parents and say "we are holding your son for felony drug trafficking".
"It's funnier that way." |
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CMH
Gender: Male
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 12 on 9/23/2003 12:43 AM >
| | | | Ohh, and I know what you mean about playing dumb  .
"It's funnier that way." |
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1993gt40
Location: Austin, Texas.
Gender: Male
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 13 on 9/23/2003 12:56 AM >
| | | | Hey there, I can answer any question you may have concerning this matter. I am a very experienced captain with 1,000+ hours logged at the helm. All of my boating has been done in Texas (well, a little in Hawaii, but not important).
First off, what city and county are you planning to be in? The second important question is how long is the boat? If it's under 16' the laws are a little more relaxed. And the third most important question is do you plan on using a motor of any sort?
Depending on the answers to these questions there are a few things you should be careful of. I'm almost certain you will have to fulfill the following: PFD for everyone on board (make sure everyone has a life jacket [no, you dont have to have it on]). You must have a Type IV throwable personal flotation device aboard ($100 ticket, I just paid one). If you have ANY sort of propulsion (INCLUDING sail, but other than paddles) you must have a working horn (air horn is fine) AND a fire extinguisher.
And ABSOLUTELY WITHOUT A DOUBT make certain that your boat is registered and titled with a CURRENT sticker (little square sticker with the state of Texas in it w/ 2 numbers). Operation of an unregistered boat is a $400 ticket!
Depending on where you boat, the water your on (no matter how small) is most likely STATE property.
The biggest concern you have to look out for is Game Wardens. They have a LOT of power and can write you tickets for anything (ANYTHING including things like speeding on land!?). If you plan on using fishing as an excuse of some sort make CERTAIN all of you have current fishing licences. Fishing without a licence is a $250 ticket and they can and will confiscate(sp?) your poles. any tackle AND the boat itself. Game Wardens are nasty, and they are out in force this time of year (hunting season soon). Some say that the game wardens would write their own mothers tickets. I believe it, trust me.
With all this in mind. Have fun! If you have any questions I have not answered, feel free to e-mail me.
Freelance OPEC taste tester. |
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cerebral
Location: Twin Cities, MN
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 14 on 9/23/2003 5:30 AM >
| | | | Posted by 1993gt40
First off, what city and county are you planning to be in? The second important question is how long is the boat? If it's under 16' the laws are a little more relaxed. And the third most important question is do you plan on using a motor of any sort?
Depending on the answers to these questions there are a few things you should be careful of. I'm almost certain you will have to fulfill the following: PFD for everyone on board (make sure everyone has a life jacket [no, you dont have to have it on]). You must have a Type IV throwable personal flotation device aboard ($100 ticket, I just paid one). If you have ANY sort of propulsion (INCLUDING sail, but other than paddles) you must have a working horn (air horn is fine) AND a fire extinguisher.
And ABSOLUTELY WITHOUT A DOUBT make certain that your boat is registered and titled with a CURRENT sticker (little square sticker with the state of Texas in it w/ 2 numbers). Operation of an unregistered boat is a $400 ticket! |
I live in WI and I have a 12' canoe. I don't have to register it in my state, but if I use it in MN, even though I live in WI, I need to pay, I believe, the WI DNR something like $9.50...maybe they forward it to MN, I dunno. They probably give me some stickers for it, too, I just haven't needed it yet. I sure would like to canoe up and down the Mississippi River through the Twin Cities area to get to the drains I havne't been able to access yet.
Drains, tunnels, bridges and caves mostly.
This ain't the land of the free. This ain't the home of the brave. -accidentally misquoted MDC...leaving it this way on purpose |
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Freak
Location: Usually Alaska, now MSP.
Gender: Male
Hypocrite
| | | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 15 on 9/23/2003 6:54 AM >
| | | | I canoed through downtown Fairbanks on saturday, the only attention we got was some dirty looks from people in a jetboat when we were playing around in a whirlpool and got in their way. We went up a small drain, but it was only 5ft diameter and half full of water, so we had to lie in the boat and push along the cieling, it sucked. I didn't risk bringing my camera, so no pics of that. Canoes and jetboats are pretty common on the river that goes through town, and I think we could probably get away with sailing a raft made of styrofoam and plywood if we wanted, as long as we all had life jackets
When I lived in Sitka(coastal town) there was a drain that I'd kayak up occasionally, it came out in someone's backyard and after the first time I guess they just resigned themselves to having wierd people in boats appear out of the pipe.
Turn off the internet and go play outside.
http://spamusement...hp/comics/view/137 |
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Valiant Dancer
Location: Villa Park, IL
Gender: Male
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 16 on 9/23/2003 6:56 PM >
| | | | Posted by CMH4
Here's the plan: In a few weeks 3 of us are heading up to a nearby city bearing flashlights, cameras... and an aluminum boat. Those little pond fishing kind. This city has large creeks that crisscross it, and we want to boat down these creeks and find outfalls. Sometimes the creeks are visible from roads, sometimes they are just in forests. Either way, I'm sure several hundred people will end up seeing us in the course of a few hours. Does anyone know the general legality of boating in the creek? I can't imagine just being tossed in jail, but I could see the cops not liking that kind of thing.
Sorry to ask such a general and Googleable question, but I have no clue where to start searching.
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Try the General Assembly site for your state. They usually have searchable databases for public laws and compiled statutes.
Knowing what state helps in finding out what laws apply.
Important factor is not relying on the Free Waterway Act of 1819 as it only applies to navagable waterways. That is, streams and rivers able to be navigated by commercial boats. The difference? 10 - 15 foot draft vs 1-2 foot draft. In Illinois, all waterways are considered public land unless the property owner specifically posts no tresspassing signage. PFD requirements and craft licencing apply where applicable.
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Krenta
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Nope, wasn't me.
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 17 on 9/23/2003 10:43 PM >
| | | | Krazy: boating or kayaking in a drain here would, technically, be "trespassing on critical public infrastructure"... if a bunch of conditions are met. There was s short thread about it on the 907's site...
Have Speed Graphic, Will Travel. |
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MacGyver
Location: St Paul, Minnesota
Gender: Male
"Someone go find me a paperclip, a D-cell battery, and a cheese grater"
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 18 on 9/23/2003 10:50 PM >
| | | | All that for boating in a drain? Maybe if you got a kayak into some of the wetter parts of the labyrinth...
Like a fiend with his dope / a drunkard his wine / a man will have lust for the lure of the mine
"If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent." |
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CMH
Gender: Male
| | Re: Legality of boating in the city?
<Reply # 19 on 9/25/2003 12:29 AM >
| | | | I have no plans to actually boat in the drain, we are just using the boat to go down creeks and look for outfalls.
"It's funnier that way." |
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