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 wander wagon
Gender: Male
 |  | Mine hazards:
< on 9/1/2003 12:22 PM >
|  | | | A school teacher in Virginia City NV. Used to warn the students not to enter any of the mines up here on the Comstock. Signs were posted at all the mines depicting a skull and crossbones with the words, "Stay out! Stay alive!"
One day during the off season a friend came and visited the teacher. "Show me the inside of a real mine?" He asked the teacher. Well, The teacher explained that as it was off season, none of the tours were open. But the pal insisted to see one anyway, so, the teacher felt it would be OK to take his friend a short distance inside the Savage Mine. When they didn't show up for the bar-b-Q
later, their folks became worried and called the police. Their bodies were found only 40 feet from the entrance of the mine! The fire Department put on their air packs and draged the bodies out. The teacher and friend had ventured only a little way inside the mine, found the air foul and were returning to the entrance but were overcome.
Other dangers of mine exploration are:
Winezs; The miners follow a vein which turns downward several hundred feet and then fizzles out. They then return to where the vein began to turn down and continue mineing the origional vein. They cover the winez with wood to provide a bridge over it. 100 years later the wood has rotted from the bottom side up due to the moisture from water filling the bottom of the winze. The topside of the wood is covered with sand, dirt, dust , pebbles and such as to hide the wood and make it look like the rest of the floor. An unexpecting explorer steps on the old cover and is dumped 1200 feet down into the water!
BAD AIR/METHANE GAS:
SNAKES: Snakes must have an even temperature to live in because they are cold blooded, They have no method to cool down or warm up. Caves and mine shafts provide warmth in winter and coolness in summerso, guess where you will find snakes thriving?
Bob cats, mountain lions, etc. like old mines for the same reason as the snakes.
Bats like caves and mines too! Bat poop, (Guano) drys and can cause lung diseases when you walk and raise dust
Rotten or lose timbers can give out from the vibrations of your movements.
[email protected] |
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rogerneon
Location: Portland, Oregon USA
Gender: Male
| |  |  | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 1 on 11/7/2003 5:34 PM >
|  | | | All very good points. I would only elaborate on the winze point by saying that you're in greater danger from falls in a mine than you are from cave-ins. Even an open shaft can be difficult to see under the poor light conditions of a mine.
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Samurai
    
Vehicular Lord Rick
Location: northeastern New York
No matter where you go, there you are...
| | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 2 on 11/8/2003 7:52 AM >
| | | | Excellent post! Here in northeastern NY we have iron ore mines everywhere. Growing up here, you just get used to them and accept them as part of the landscape, which does take away some of the adventure. Anyways, a few years back, a few intrepid local kids decided to explore the ice mines (an air shaft leading into the 21 mine) and damn near got killed. One of the party had almost walked off into a 1500ft vertical shaft. Then they got stuck in the mine, couldn't climb back out. A couple of kids chipping ice for a keg party heard them yelling and called the fire department to haul them out.
The mine that myself and tonydukes have been exploring in Tahawus NY is different in that it is a strip/pit mine and has filled with water. Takes that element right out of it, BUT there is a place on the backside of Crown Point NY where the forest has completely grown over and old mine town and there are shafts everywhere around it (Hammondville, NY)... that is a bad place to stay away from.
Here, they can't seal the mines off because if they tried to blast the entrances and that caused a cave in, there's a good chance that the hamlets of Mineville and Witherbee NY are going to end up sinking a good distance. As it is, whenever one part of the tunnel system becomes unstable, the whole hamlet shakes and rattles. It's kind of scary until you get used to it... 
Samurai
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Greysand
Noble Donor
Location: USA - California
Gender: Male
| |  | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 3 on 11/8/2003 7:17 PM >
|  | | | Holy carp man.. That's some crazy shizzle.. I'm glad I live in the peoples republic of Kalifornia. Where the ground never moves..
Lucky for me there's nothing wrong with Kalifornia that a rise in the oceans level won't fix.. I dunno what there gunna do about your place..
I don't mind Drain fog... I like to see what I breathe. |
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PonyGrl420
Location: NY
Gender: Female
huh??
| |  | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 4 on 11/8/2003 8:50 PM >
| | | | Some good info wander
In PA there is the coal regons, that whole area makes me nervous. Im into 4 wheelin and its one of the best places to go but im scared to go most places. The whole area is very unstable, I hear stories of entire trucks allmost gettin swallowed up, and people hiking and fallin into giant holes. I duuno if i would want to explore a underground mine, a lil to unstable for me, I like to be able to identify my risks.
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Uncle Goose
Location: Ghent, Belgium
Gender: Male
The Goose knows best.
| | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 5 on 11/11/2003 7:40 PM >
| | | | We have some mines here in Belgium that are abandoned but No way I would ever think of it to enter them. I saw pictures of them and they are very dangerous, some almost on the brink of collapse. Entering stuff like that is asking to get killed.
A 1000 days of sorrow can disapear in a split second, it takes only one person to make it happen. |
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Titch
Location: Belgium-Liege (Europe)
Gender: Male
Member of Green Explorers
| | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 6 on 11/14/2003 9:34 AM >
| | | | Yeah you're right Uncle Goose.
I went to one of these Belgian Mines (Cheratte mine which is on my website), and we found an entrance to a mine tunnel. It was pretty dangerous, and we explored it for only +- 150 meters. The roof was collapsing everywhere, air was of bad quality,... so you don't feel well in this kind of underground!
This mine was closed in 1977. Less than 30 years later it's like after an explosion inside!
Uncle Goose have you any information about Limburgse mines because we want to explore there and no information at the moment.
Green Explorers are recruitings new members.
Ask more details to Titch |
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Uncle Goose
Location: Ghent, Belgium
Gender: Male
The Goose knows best.
| | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 7 on 11/14/2003 4:56 PM >
| | | | Too bad, that's not really my region. Although I was thinking to do Cheratte this summer I'm not very familiar with the mines in Belgium. It's just too far to do that regulary.
A 1000 days of sorrow can disapear in a split second, it takes only one person to make it happen. |
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Freak
Location: Usually Alaska, now MSP.
Gender: Male
Hypocrite
| | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 8 on 11/16/2003 12:17 PM >
| | | | Most of the mines I explolre are hard rock (gold/copper mines), and very stable, but I've seen a few pretty dodgy ones. The mine near my home had a lot of shallow tunnels dug just below the ground in a swampy area, once the ground was destabalized and the timbers rotted (lots of water flow through there) the shallow tunnels collapsed and left a bunch of long trenches through the woods. Even the entrances to some deeper tunnels got destroyed this way, if they came out in an area of looser rock or swamp.
One entrance to the AJ mine (which I've been trying to get into for years) actually had some extensive collapsing of the seemingly solid walls and ceiling. In parts we had to climb up over the rubble filling the tunnel and actually walk in the empty cavity left when the rock we were walking on fell down... That one scared me so much that I left a note in a ziplock bag partway in telling future explores to just forget it, that it isn't worth it.
One thing I want to know is how dangerous methane is in non-coal mines? The accepted method for testing air quality in gold mines around here is to light a candle, if it goes out there's insufficient oxygen and it's time to get out. I've never heard of anyone blowing themselves up this way, but if that happened it's likely that no one would ever know.
Turn off the internet and go play outside.
http://spamusement...hp/comics/view/137 |
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Uncle Goose
Location: Ghent, Belgium
Gender: Male
The Goose knows best.
| | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 9 on 11/16/2003 12:48 PM >
| | | | Methane may explode when the level is higher than 6% . Below this it's non-flamable. Since it's non-poisonous it is only dangerous when the oxygen level drops below a certain point (I believe 17% but I'm not sure).
A 1000 days of sorrow can disapear in a split second, it takes only one person to make it happen. |
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Intalex
This member has been banned
Ascended Being
| | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 10 on 11/19/2003 1:10 AM >
| | | | I live in Cornwall, UK, an area renowned for its tin, copper and clay mining.
The mined china clay is formed during the breakdown of granite. This produces clay with pockets of radioactive radon gas. The extraction process for this clay is to spray the cliff face with water, allowing the water to collect in a lake at the bottom of the pit. This usually collects the radon gas, but exploring an abandoned pit can easily enduce radiation poisoning. So can swimming in the lake at the bottom.
The tin mines are mined in much the same way that wander wagon describes the following of the vien. With the exception that pure ARSENIC is used to extract the tin! This arsenic is left lying around in huge heaps. These heaps are 100% caustic, and as a result no plant life grows on them. Every single tin miner in early 19th century Cornwall died very prematurly of arsenic poisoning. One of the most stupid things that anyone can do, is enter a tin mine without wearing at least a gas mask, hard hat and NBC suit. As a cornish tin mine guide once said, "feel free to go in but don't lick the walls".
Mining copper is a somewhat simpler process, with less chemical threat. The only problem is, that while wondering around off the beaten track, you run the risk of falling to a maximum depth of 1500 meters. There are places that you can visit, and official tours you can take - seriously stick to these.
In case anyone is wondering, it is in fact Coal mines that run the risk of containing methane. The older the mine, the worse it will be
Gold mines are worth avoiding too. Due to the large amount of water used in the extraction process, the chances of wooden beams being rotten are very high.
No mine is a safe mine. Each type of ore behaves very differently, and without a proper understanding of the risks, entering isn't even worth thinking about. Generally open cast mines are much safer, but there are still risks involving landslides and collapsing equipment.
Thats about all I know on the subject, hope it helps.
"What's that smell?" "Oh that would be me, I've been swimming in raw sewage, I love it!" - Naked Gun |
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Titch
Location: Belgium-Liege (Europe)
Gender: Male
Member of Green Explorers
| | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 11 on 11/19/2003 10:04 AM >
| | | | Nice description Twin Turbo!
Just to add about the coal mines that they are also 2 others big dangers :
-collapsing on the floor, you'll fall 30 meters below (as meanwhile there is 30m between each floors).
-breaking of a water pocket (not usual but if it happens, you're dead. It happenned last year at the coal mine of Cheratte, and entire streets in this town were flooded!)
[last edit 11/19/2003 10:05 AM by Titch - edited 1 times]
Green Explorers are recruitings new members.
Ask more details to Titch |
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rogerneon
Location: Portland, Oregon USA
Gender: Male
| | | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 12 on 11/20/2003 3:02 AM >
| | | | Cyanide is/was frequently used to process gold ore, though I suppose if it poses a hazard it would be in the mill or "tailings" rather than in the mine itself (apparently cyanide dissolves gold).
I know nothing about the chemical properties of cyanide, so I don't know if it's something that stays around forever or if it decays/evaporates over time.
When I was a kid (only slightly after the earth's crust had cooled) I spent quite a bit of time wandering around old gold mining sites in Eastern Oregon, and at that time you could still find remnants of the cans cyanide was shipped in. They were actually rectangular, and held five or ten gallons. Flattened out, the tin found a variety of other uses like roofing material, siding, or anything else that needed thin sheet metal.
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Intalex
This member has been banned
Ascended Being
| | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 13 on 11/20/2003 4:12 AM >
| | | | Posted by rogerneon
Cyanide is/was frequently used to process gold ore, though I suppose if it poses a hazard it would be in the mill or "tailings" rather than in the mine itself (apparently cyanide dissolves gold).
I know nothing about the chemical properties of cyanide, so I don't know if it's something that stays around forever or if it decays/evaporates over time.
When I was a kid (only slightly after the earth's crust had cooled) I spent quite a bit of time wandering around old gold mining sites in Eastern Oregon, and at that time you could still find remnants of the cans cyanide was shipped in. They were actually rectangular, and held five or ten gallons. Flattened out, the tin found a variety of other uses like roofing material, siding, or anything else that needed thin sheet metal.
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Yes you are completely right. The gold ore is usually shipped away to a very remote place. There, they seperate the gold using settling tanks, shaking tables and water. Once they have it as pure as they can get it, they seperate it using cyanide, which as you know kills instantly. Because cyanide reacts with the gold, the gold seperates itself from any impurities, which eventually sink to the bottom of the cyanide tank. After this process, I beleive they flush out the cyanide, then seperate the cyanide from the gold.
I might have this wrong, but it's about as much as I can remember from science lessons and gold mine trips.
The general rule with mines is, if it looks unsafe, then it is. If it doesn't look unsafe, then it's a hard hat.
For those of you who don't know, that was an old miners joke, back during protests of unsafe working conditions.
Another thing to bear in mind, is that recently abandoned sites, especially coal mines, are usually abandoned because they are too dangerous to work in. If you are totally unsure, try and find logbooks or any other kind of similar info.
"What's that smell?" "Oh that would be me, I've been swimming in raw sewage, I love it!" - Naked Gun |
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MacGyver
Location: St Paul, Minnesota
Gender: Male
"Someone go find me a paperclip, a D-cell battery, and a cheese grater"
| | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 14 on 11/20/2003 6:49 AM >
| | | | I vaguely remember seeing on some documentary about gold mining somewhere on the far side of the world (I think it was in Africa) where the miners would use mercury to separate the gold from the impurities. The documentary was stressing how the mercury was poisoning the water supply when it was being carelessly discarded by the miners. Does mercury do the same job as cyanide in this regard? That would be another reason to be leary of gold mines.
Like a fiend with his dope / a drunkard his wine / a man will have lust for the lure of the mine
"If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent." |
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Intalex
This member has been banned
Ascended Being
| | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 15 on 11/20/2003 7:11 AM >
| | | | Posted by Krazy
I vaguely remember seeing on some documentary about gold mining somewhere on the far side of the world (I think it was in Africa) where the miners would use mercury to separate the gold from the impurities. The documentary was stressing how the mercury was poisoning the water supply when it was being carelessly discarded by the miners. Does mercury do the same job as cyanide in this regard? That would be another reason to be leary of gold mines.
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Mercury does very little. It sits there sloshing about.
It is very poisonous, you are right. It most likely reacts with something in the ore, causing the ore to crumble away leaving gold nuggets or something along those lines.
The good thing with mercury is that it's a bright silver shiny goo that smells metallic, the problem with cyanide being that it evaporates quickly, and kills instantly.
"What's that smell?" "Oh that would be me, I've been swimming in raw sewage, I love it!" - Naked Gun |
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Freak
Location: Usually Alaska, now MSP.
Gender: Male
Hypocrite
| | | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 16 on 11/20/2003 8:27 AM >
| | | | Mercury apparently isn't as hazardous as Cyanide in water, it's heavier than water and doesn't dissolve into it, and in some cases it can be sitting at the bottom of your water supply with no ill effects. I read an article that said that Juneau's water supply (which is stored and mixed with chlorine in an old mine tunnel) has trace amounts of mercury, but not enough to be dangerous. Mercury does however get absorbed rapidly through human skin, and through the lungs when vaporized in a smelter or furnace. It's easy to identify (looks like molten silver metal at room temperature) and should be easy to avoid touching/breathing during exploring.
There's a mine near my home that has a large amount of Arsenic lying around, it's a by-product of certain mining techniques. When we were playing around there as kids the owner told us not to touch or eat any of the white powder that was covering anything in the mill  For a while there was also an old rotting shack with boxes of what looked like moldy dynamite, but the guy eventually buried that with his bulldozer.
Turn off the internet and go play outside.
http://spamusement...hp/comics/view/137 |
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Mark
Very Noble Donor
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
What is a lion, king of the savannah, when hes at the south pole?
| | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 17 on 11/20/2003 8:44 AM >
| | | | Just a side note mecuray is also in fish. They say dont eat to much of certian kind of fish for that reason.
"If the threat level goes up its probably because of me." "I am looking for a girl who enjoys headbutting beltbuckles" |
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Intalex
This member has been banned
Ascended Being
| | Re: Mine hazards:
<Reply # 18 on 11/20/2003 9:51 AM >
| | | | Posted by Freak
Mercury apparently isn't as hazardous as Cyanide in water, it's heavier than water and doesn't dissolve into it, and in some cases it can be sitting at the bottom of your water supply with no ill effects. I read an article that said that Juneau's water supply (which is stored and mixed with chlorine in an old mine tunnel) has trace amounts of mercury, but not enough to be dangerous. Mercury does however get absorbed rapidly through human skin, and through the lungs when vaporized in a smelter or furnace. It's easy to identify (looks like molten silver metal at room temperature) and should be easy to avoid touching/breathing during exploring.
There's a mine near my home that has a large amount of Arsenic lying around, it's a by-product of certain mining techniques. When we were playing around there as kids the owner told us not to touch or eat any of the white powder that was covering anything in the mill For a while there was also an old rotting shack with boxes of what looked like moldy dynamite, but the guy eventually buried that with his bulldozer.
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Mercury tends to be something that kills people over an extended period of time. Miners suffer from the effects of Mercury vapour, but usually this vapour gets tapped by the mine company. (its used in some lightbulbs)
The arsenic you talk about, are you totally sure that it was a by-product? Because usually mining companies don't leave such caustic byproducts lying around in heaps like that, they sell it. What's more likely, is that it was a tin mine, and they were using the arsenic to extract the tin.
Although I may have my concept of tin mining wrong. But most mining companies sell ALL their byproducts unless they are completely useless (IE dirt). Especially something like arsenic, which is used in alot of chemical processes, and as part of rodent bait.
"What's that smell?" "Oh that would be me, I've been swimming in raw sewage, I love it!" - Naked Gun |
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