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 ofberenonehand
   
Location: Minn-e-snow-ta
"Where now is Boromir the Fair? He tarries and I grieve."
 |  | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 20 on 12/15/2004 5:25 PM >
|  | | | Ok, before this thread is locked when you two start throwing punches....I'd like to get a comment in.
I understand the need to enforce the rules (though I would not script them the same way, that is an issue with the server-company so there is no point debating it). I do, however have an issue with anything being modified without notice/markings.
I have had a few posts modified by mods. They always leave a mod note saying something was deleted, modified, etc... I'm fine with this. Both images and words serve to represent someone to everyone else (hope that makes sense to everyone). I would be very upset if something of mine was modified with no public notice.
AV gave the argument (in the other porn thread) that it would take forever to notify everyone who had something edited. I think it would take less time to send the poster a PM asking them to remove or modify it than to actually do it themselves. If they are taking the time to modify it it probably wouldn't take much longer to leave a comment saying it had been edited by a mod.
No one memorises all the rules and there will always be things that need to be edited in some way. Someone will always forget, be ill informed or make a judgement call and post something that should not be on this board. That is expected.
Lastly, I have a fair amount of pics I've been meaning to upload from quite a few locations (and some new locations). I am hesitant to do so knowing things could be modified without me, or those looking at my work, knowing it. I don't feel like a message or allowing me to do it would be too much to ask.
Also, I don't want to sound like I'm accusing mods of doing something wrong. I know they are trying to enforce fairly reasonable rules and are probably only doing the minimum modifications necessary. The issue is really just about proper communication and representation.
"That's What Government Is For; To Get In A Man's Way" -Mal |
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Avatar-X
    
Alpha Husky
Location: West Coast
Gender: Male
yay!
| |  | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 21 on 12/15/2004 5:29 PM >
| | | | It takes literally 5 seconds to blur out an area on an image for a mod. It's very fast.
However, writing a PM, including all the links to the pictures, then waiting for the user to reply, dealing with the resulting argument, checking up on it to make sure he did actually remove/edit the pictures, doing it manually if he didn't... we're taking 5 seconds of work and turning it into a multi-day nightmare.
Now, however, I could put a little notice at the bottom of the picture; When a mod uses the "blur" function it would timestamp it so you know exactly when and by whom it was done. How's that?
-av
huskies - such fluff. |
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Jester
Location: Vancouver,B.C. Canada
Gender: Male
Always just out of sight...
| | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 22 on 12/15/2004 5:35 PM >
|  | | | Not to mention, there have been several instances where a person was Pm'ed and asked to change things and then they don't do it. So now it takes far longer to have the required result.
It requires wisdom to understand wisdom: the music is nothing if the audience is deaf. |
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TurboZutek
 
King Dick
Location: Scotland
Gender: Male
Giant octo-penised rapephant
| |  | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 23 on 12/15/2004 5:35 PM >
| | | | Posted by Avatar-X
Now, however, I could put a little notice at the bottom of the picture; When a mod uses the "blur" function it would timestamp it so you know exactly when and by whom it was done. How's that?
-av
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That would be pretty good! A 'reason' field would be cool too.. But it's just a trade off of time v. usefullness for you to decide I suppose Av.
Mate.
Chris...
We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. |
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ofberenonehand
Location: Minn-e-snow-ta
"Where now is Boromir the Fair? He tarries and I grieve."
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 24 on 12/15/2004 5:41 PM >
| | | | Ok, I didn't know they could modify the picture on the site.
A stamp would be fine. I was even just thinking they could just put a comment in the comment field for the pic. An automated stamp would be a big positive step. I suppose most modifications would be obvious, but if it was not obvious I would still appreciate the mod leaving a comment stating what was done.
Slightly off topic question: when a mod edits something does it register as a new post? So would the circle on it turn from grey to blue? If it did that would also help take care of notifying the original poster.
"That's What Government Is For; To Get In A Man's Way" -Mal |
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agent-x
Noble Donor
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 25 on 12/15/2004 7:40 PM >
| | | | Posted by Avatar-X
Now, however, I could put a little notice at the bottom of the picture; When a mod uses the "blur" function it would timestamp it so you know exactly when and by whom it was done. How's that?
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sounds reasonable.
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oCtAnE
Location: TORONTO, CANADA
Gender: Male
EXPLORER AT LARGE
| | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 26 on 12/15/2004 8:34 PM >
| | | | Posted by Avatar-X
Now, however, I could put a little notice at the bottom of the picture; When a mod uses the "blur" function it would timestamp it so you know exactly when and by whom it was done. How's that?
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That's an interesting idea...BUT....since that still negates asking, is there a way for an automatic message to be sent to a user when his/her picture gets blurred?
Hmm.
-Octane
FUELED BY OCTANE. |
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micro
Gender: Male
Slowly I turned
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 27 on 12/15/2004 9:37 PM >
| | | | "Dear <userName>, your picture has been digitally altered by one of our moderators because you were too stupid to realize that <contentType> is not tolerated on this site. Cheers!"
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Shane
Moderator
Location: Bronx, NY
Gender: Male
| |  |  |  | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 28 on 12/16/2004 12:15 AM >
| | | | How about we just forget about modifying images and just outright delete any that contain violations of the rules? No copyright infringement issues, no problem. If the user wants to repost the image with the content blurred by themselves, they are free to. It would be good if a notification was automatically sent to them (maybe with a thumbnail of the image), so that they know which image was removed, and people won't complain. Although from my understanding, there is no way to re-instate a deleted image, it has to be re-uploaded by the user.
"Because there's no possibility of real disaster, real risk, we're left with no chance for real salvation. Real elation. Real excitement. Joy. Discovery. Invention. The laws that keep us safe, these same laws condemn us to boredom. Without access to true chaos, we'll never have true peace. Unless everything can get worse, it won't get any better." -Chuck Palahniuk |
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el nerdo
  
Chief UER Lackey
Gender: Male
What are you, from the Department of Know'm Sayin's? You takin' a Know'm census?
| | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 29 on 12/16/2004 12:46 AM >
| | | | Posted by Shane
How about we just forget about modifying images and just outright delete any that contain violations of the rules? No copyright infringement issues, no problem.
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That's probably the best solution. No legal issues there at all. If something's against the rules, delete it. Problem solved.
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r00bix
Location: London, Ontaio, Canada
Gender: Male
It's just a harmless little bunny...
| | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 30 on 12/16/2004 4:19 AM >
| | | | What, you guys go somewhere other than UER for sexual gratification?
*gasps!*
But... but... I thought....
Only the unknown frightens one. But once one has faced the unknown, that terror becomes the known. |
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Duke
Noble Donor
Location: Awww-shitby, Ontario
Gender: Male
Move it or lose it
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 31 on 12/16/2004 10:19 AM >
| | | | I think people are kinda nitpicking here about certain things. Since pornography of any sort no matter how mild is not allowed by Av's hosts, and this is clearly stated in the rules we all agreed to upon registering, there's no denying that any mod should technically have the right to delete the pic and ban the user upon discovery of said violation. that they show discretion and blur the photo instead of banination is altogether petty damn good if you ask me. maybe an automated message upon blurring of the content would be the best solution:
"Dear <user>, one of your images (<link>) has been blurred due to inappropriate content contrary to the rules of the forum. in the future please censor such content out on your own yadda yadda yadda"
If it were scripted it would add no extra work for the mod, and the user can then go look at the image, see what was blurred and say to themselves "hmmmm, well now I know that's against the rules for next time" and if they notice something inappropriate in a pic they're going to upload they can then censor it themselves. oh and maybe it'd be a good idea to make the message a "system message" or something so the person can't then flame the mod for blurring their inappropriate content
Contrary to popular belief, death isn't just for dead people. I know I was surprised too! It can happen to anybody! Horses, fiddler crabs, even a potato can die! - Tick
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ofberenonehand
Location: Minn-e-snow-ta
"Where now is Boromir the Fair? He tarries and I grieve."
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 32 on 12/16/2004 3:50 PM >
| | | | I think your point about educating people in a message would be good. If they get a message and check the image and learn what was inarpropriate they will likely not post something like that again. If they don't get any notification and aren't lucky enough to happen upon the change they will not learn the rule. It makes it much more likely they will post something like that again. Not to mention they will have no idea what happened to the pic (particularly newer or less active members) and they will either get pissy or clog up the boards asking what happened.
"That's What Government Is For; To Get In A Man's Way" -Mal |
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Valiant Dancer
Location: Villa Park, IL
Gender: Male
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 33 on 12/16/2004 6:21 PM >
|  | | | Posted by Jester
Not to mention, there have been several instances where a person was Pm'ed and asked to change things and then they don't do it. So now it takes far longer to have the required result.
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And having the attendant risks from violating TOS of the web host.
Quite frankly, I find the whole discussion absurd. The sysops are giving an unpaid service for uploading pictures. Copyright or not, those pictures have to conform to the TOS of the web host.
What I would suggest, to satisfy both the web host and the user's copyright concerns, would be to delete the offending picture and replace it with a boilerplate picture message of "Content deleted due to TOS violation".
That way the web host TOS is upheld and the users don't bitch about unauthorized editing of their pictures.
It's a sledgehammer solution for users who don't like the rules of the web host.
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TurboZutek
King Dick
Location: Scotland
Gender: Male
Giant octo-penised rapephant
| | | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 34 on 12/16/2004 6:21 PM >
| | | | Posted by micro
"Dear <userName>, your picture has been digitally altered by one of our moderators because you were too stupid to realize that <contentType> is not tolerated on this site. Cheers!"
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I can see where you are coming from with that argument Micro - but I don't think it really washes in this instance; If so, why do you get a 'deleted post' message on the forums ? You obviously did something against the rules (off topic, boring, flame) for a mod to delete the post so of course you get a message telling you that.
It makes you more familiar with the rules overall and helps educate you in correct forum use. When I posted my 'porn' I had no idea that it really even counted as 'porn' and that I was doing something that could get Av in trouble with his ISP - or I wouldn't have done it in the first place.
I'm not the only one either, as the screed of 'what about this pic then?' and a link to another 'porn' picture posts appeared after mine was raised publicly.
I think the LDB should be the same as the forum - with a system message generated for deletions / modifications.
That's my opinion, it's down to Av to weigh up the option.
Chris...
We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. |
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TurboZutek
King Dick
Location: Scotland
Gender: Male
Giant octo-penised rapephant
| | | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 35 on 12/16/2004 6:23 PM >
| | | | Posted by Valiant Dancer
What I would suggest, to satisfy both the web host and the user's copyright concerns, would be to delete the offending picture and replace it with a boilerplate picture message of "Content deleted due to TOS violation".
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That could work as well as or better than an outright deletion followed by a message.
Chris...
We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. |
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MacGyver
Location: St Paul, Minnesota
Gender: Male
"Someone go find me a paperclip, a D-cell battery, and a cheese grater"
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 36 on 12/16/2004 6:56 PM >
| | | | What if something was coded that would allow LDB mods to "replace" an unacceptable picture with a self-explanatory placeholder and at the same time notify the person that uploaded the file that it needs their attention. Ideally, the user would be able to reupload a censored or different version on their own that would then replace the placeholder and an LDB mod see some kind of flag indicating that a the new image needed to be inspected.
Perhaps the original notification to the user could give them an option of the above or they could check a box that gives a moderator permission to censor or otherwise deal with the image for them.
Overall, this solves several problems. It's easier than using a bunch of PMs and links to get a user to fix something (a truly grueling task to follow up on), it notifies the user of their violation, and it also lets them fix it themselves OR allows them to give written permission to the mod to change the image, which hopefully works around all the copyright stuff.
Anyone care to further build on this idea?
Like a fiend with his dope / a drunkard his wine / a man will have lust for the lure of the mine
"If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent." |
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Servo
| | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 37 on 12/16/2004 7:06 PM >
| | | | It sounds like a good idea to me, Mac.
Another problem is that the terms that apply to images uploaded here have never really been clearly defined -- it might be a good idea at some time in the future to lay out exactly what "license" the user is granting UER when they upload images.
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TurboZutek
King Dick
Location: Scotland
Gender: Male
Giant octo-penised rapephant
| | | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 38 on 12/16/2004 8:47 PM >
| | | | Posted by Servo
It sounds like a good idea to me, Mac.
Another problem is that the terms that apply to images uploaded here have never really been clearly defined -- it might be a good idea at some time in the future to lay out exactly what "license" the user is granting UER when they upload images.
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I second whole heartedly both the points Servo raises above. Good idea Mac and yes, I think clarity of 'contract' might be an idea.
I know of a few people who have done some STUNNING photo work (UE related and not) but wouldn't upload it out of paranoia they will see it on the side of a cornflakes box one morning or something.
Chris...
We all had ostriches. My dad had an ostrich farm! I remember one day someone came in and said the high altitude bombing of Kosovo had been a limited success, so we all went out and celebrated… by killing an ostrich and boiling it in kiwi fruit. |
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greywolf45
Location: U.S.A.
Gender: Male
Resident UER pain in the ass
| |  | | Re: Clarification required
<Reply # 39 on 12/17/2004 6:18 AM >
| | | | Posted by MacGyver
What if something was coded that would allow LDB mods to "replace" an unacceptable picture with a self-explanatory placeholder and at the same time notify the person that uploaded the file that it needs their attention. Ideally, the user would be able to reupload a censored or different version on their own that would then replace the placeholder and an LDB mod see some kind of flag indicating that a the new image needed to be inspected.
Perhaps the original notification to the user could give them an option of the above or they could check a box that gives a moderator permission to censor or otherwise deal with the image for them.
Overall, this solves several problems. It's easier than using a bunch of PMs and links to get a user to fix something (a truly grueling task to follow up on), it notifies the user of their violation, and it also lets them fix it themselves OR allows them to give written permission to the mod to change the image, which hopefully works around all the copyright stuff.
Anyone care to further build on this idea?
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I like this idea too MacGyver, well thought out.
"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends"
Martin Luther King Jr. |
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