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 Beagle
     
Location: Oxfordshire, England
Gender: Male
Who Dares Wins!
 |  |  | RF Radiadion
< on 10/5/2004 12:06 PM >
|  | | | What does RF Radiation do to your health in the long term?
Fight the battle, win the war! Who Dares Wins |
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Corvid
 
Location: Oxford, UK
Gender: Male
Master of Illusion!!
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 1 on 10/5/2004 12:08 PM >
| | | | Yo beagle,
It all depends on the antenna type, size, output and your position.
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Mutt
 
Moderator
Location: Bunbury, Western Australia
Support your local Funeral Director ----- Drop Dead!
| |  | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 2 on 10/5/2004 12:25 PM >
| | | | Also the wavelength (frequency) of the radation. Higher frequencies are far more harmfull at a power level that would harnles at low frequency.
5 watts of rf at say 27 megahertz, CB radio area of the spectrum, is harmless where as 5 watts of 10 gigahertz, radar tracking range, will likely result in RF burns. Again, depending upon focus, frequency and power, your results may vary.
The World Health Organization has an excellent fact sheet here about RF exposure.
http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs226/en/
Enjoy.....but don't cook yourself
All men are cremated equal. |
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Giblet
Location: Atlanta
Gender: Male
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 3 on 10/5/2004 1:13 PM >
| | | | Here's a trick from my days in the .mil:
Buy a flash-cube (some drug stores still carry them) and hang it around your neck by a piece of string. If it goes off, your family jewels are in danger of cooking - so go back the way you came! Right Now.
RF energy is electro-magnetic. A magnetic field that passes through a conductor (magnesium fluff inside flash-cube) will induce a voltage in that conductor. RF that is fairly strong will set a flash bulb off before it actually cooks your gutty-works.
Disclaimer: it is still possible to fry your guts without setting off the flash, but it's very unlikely.
If you climb a UHF antenna mast that is transmitting, you can expect the flash bulb to go off about 10-20 meters from the antenna. That means it's time to leave. Radar (1Ghz and up) will set off the flash at much longer distances (up to 3 miles away!)
First symptom of getting 'cooked' is temporary sterility. Nobody wants that, so stay away from operational antennas of ANY kind.
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Mutt
Moderator
Location: Bunbury, Western Australia
Support your local Funeral Director ----- Drop Dead!
| | | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 4 on 10/5/2004 4:38 PM >
| | | | What an excellent idea! I think I have some bulbs around here somewhere in the shack. I'll have to fire up the sat transmitter to see if it works for me, and no I won't hand hold the bulb.
All men are cremated equal. |
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skankin_Steve
Location: Ye Olde E Towne
Gender: Male
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 5 on 10/5/2004 5:34 PM >
| | | | I sometimes wonder about how much radiation i've been exposed to at work. I marshall aircraft, once the a/c lands it's supposed to turn off it's weather radar. But people forget, right. With most of the aircraft that come on to my ramp that carry weather radar, their antenna's are right around the height of my bit's and pieces.
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Corvid
Location: Oxford, UK
Gender: Male
Master of Illusion!!
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 6 on 10/6/2004 9:49 AM >
| | | | Genrally, the site will have warning signs telling you of the danger. If not, it MAY be safe to climb. In response to the flash cube idea, also carry a flourecant strip lighting bulb (havent tried, but heard it works).
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ngamer007
Location: Upstate NY
Gender: Male
Time for some thrilling heroics.
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 7 on 10/6/2004 3:31 PM >
| | | | I'm going to sound like an idiot, but what the hell is a flash cube? I've looked everywhere online (ebay, froogle, google, some camera websites), I can't find anything on it... not a picture, not a name... nothing.
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ofberenonehand
Location: Minn-e-snow-ta
"Where now is Boromir the Fair? He tarries and I grieve."
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 8 on 10/6/2004 3:38 PM >
| | | | My assumption is a camera flash bulb, but that's just from what I gathered in this thread.
"That's What Government Is For; To Get In A Man's Way" -Mal |
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Spyder
Location: Ottawa
Gender: Male
Holy Fuck!!! There's a tree frog in the toilet!
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 9 on 10/6/2004 4:57 PM >
| | | | Posted by ngamer007
I'm going to sound like an idiot, but what the hell is a flash cube? I've looked everywhere online (ebay, froogle, google, some camera websites), I can't find anything on it... not a picture, not a name... nothing.
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here is a picture of another use for flashcubes.
http://www.stupid.com/stat/CUBF.html
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Servo
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 10 on 10/6/2004 5:07 PM >
| | | | Posted by ngamer007
I'm going to sound like an idiot, but what the hell is a flash cube?
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Well let me tell ya sonny, back in the day before electronic flashes, we had to change out hot flashbulbs after every picture! Because you could only use 'em once! So Clyde down at the factory found a way to put several small bulbs in a little cube. So you could take 4, 8, hell on some even 20 or so pictures before you had to throw the entire thing away! Hail innovation...
(it seems like flash cubes would get kinda expensive to find since AFAIK no one makes them anymore, but I guess it only has to work once...)
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MacGyver
Location: St Paul, Minnesota
Gender: Male
"Someone go find me a paperclip, a D-cell battery, and a cheese grater"
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 11 on 10/6/2004 6:45 PM >
| | | | flash cubes might be difficult to come by. flash bulbs on the other hand are still used by some niche subterranean photographers I know. They usually purchase them from ebay as a novelty or junk item at a very low cost. I can't guarantee a flash bulb will behave the same way a cube flash will, but then again I can't guarantee a cube flash will do what people say they will...
Like a fiend with his dope / a drunkard his wine / a man will have lust for the lure of the mine
"If you are not part of the solution, you are not dissolved in the solvent." |
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Freak
Location: Usually Alaska, now MSP.
Gender: Male
Hypocrite
| | | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 12 on 10/6/2004 7:18 PM >
| | | | Lurk around thrift stores and pawn shops for a while, you'll probably find a box of flash cubes or at least one or two eventually. My mom still has some with her ancient 110 camera. I also have a really ancient flashbulb that's basically a light bulb filled with aluminum foil and hair-thin wire, but I'm not sacrificing that!
Next time I'm home I'll stick one of those flashcubes in front of our satellite internet dish. The radiation at the focal point is supposed to be pretty high (I forget the specs now), so I'll see if it works.
Turn off the internet and go play outside.
http://spamusement...hp/comics/view/137 |
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Skaught
Location: Calgary
Gender: Male
| | | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 13 on 10/7/2004 4:01 AM >
| | | | I do microwave for a living. I have had a great deal of exposure at 38ghz, 5.8ghz, 3.5ghz, 5.8 ghz, 2.4ghz and 900mhz.
I would not stick my nads next to an antenna for long periods but overall I am much more concerned about radiation from the sun.
And we have a prominent explorer here in cowtown that marshalls aircraft. But for reasons of security he shall go unnamed.
[last edit 10/7/2004 4:03 AM by Skaught - edited 1 times]
If you ever come to Calgary then email [email protected] and you'll be made welcome, taken to locations and given free accommodation. We'll help save you the $$$ you spend on the flight over here :) |
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Giblet
Location: Atlanta
Gender: Male
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 14 on 10/7/2004 11:26 PM >
| | | | Posted by skankin_Steve
I sometimes wonder about how much radiation i've been exposed to at work. I marshall aircraft, once the a/c lands it's supposed to turn off it's weather radar. But people forget, right. With most of the aircraft that come on to my ramp that carry weather radar, their antenna's are right around the height of my bit's and pieces.
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The effects of RF radiation are not, generally, long-lasting or cumulative (brain-cooking aside).
You're thinking of Alpha and Gamma radiation where the effects are cumulative over time. RF doesn't work that way.
If you're stupid^H^H^H^H^Hunlucky enough to get 'cooked' to the point where you're sterilized for a few weeks, you'll be right as rain (what a stupid term) at the end of those few weeks and you can go get cooked again, with a similar effect.
If you get sterilized by Alpha particles or gamma radiation, hurry up and pick out a nice headstone while you can...
A more serious danger around hi-power RF is the certain presence of lethal voltages and currents. The insulation on those cables running up the tower was probably state-of-the-art 20 years ago, but now the electrons running back-and-forth in those cables are bored with the whole routine and would love to come visit your leg or arm...or your face! If they do, one of two things will happen:
1) You will be fried to a charcoal briquet, clinging to a tower. CNN will broadcast your new, crumbly-yet-cheerful grin across the globe.
2) You will be thrown 30 feet from the tower and released into the custody of the laws of gravity.
But that's being really negative...
It is equally important to entertain your mission-pals with convincing sound-effects like "ZzzzzzzzzZAPP!". This will always get a laugh and earn you lasting admiration and loyalty.
"Hey y'all, watch this!"
-- Most commonly heard Last Words
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Slickis
Noble Donor
Location: Kokomo, Indiana
Gender: Male
Rest In Piece Booger 4-6-08
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 15 on 10/7/2004 11:34 PM >
| | | | Posted by Giblet
The effects of RF radiation are not, generally, long-lasting or cumulative (brain-cooking aside).
You're thinking of Alpha and Gamma radiation where the effects are cumulative over time. RF doesn't work that way.
If you're stupid^H^H^H^H^Hunlucky enough to get 'cooked' to the point where you're sterilized for a few weeks, you'll be right as rain (what a stupid term) at the end of those few weeks and you can go get cooked again, with a similar effect.
If you get sterilized by Alpha particles or gamma radiation, hurry up and pick out a nice headstone while you can...
A more serious danger around hi-power RF is the certain presence of lethal voltages and currents. The insulation on those cables running up the tower was probably state-of-the-art 20 years ago, but now the electrons running back-and-forth in those cables are bored with the whole routine and would love to come visit your leg or arm...or your face! If they do, one of two things will happen:
1) You will be fried to a charcoal briquet, clinging to a tower. CNN will broadcast your new, crumbly-yet-cheerful grin across the globe.
2) You will be thrown 30 feet from the tower and released into the custody of the laws of gravity.
But that's being really negative...
It is equally important to entertain your mission-pals with convincing sound-effects like "ZzzzzzzzzZAPP!". This will always get a laugh and earn you lasting admiration and loyalty.
"Hey y'all, watch this!"
-- Most commonly heard Last Words
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Gamma is worse than alpha as alpha is much more short lived but if you breath an alpha particle say right after a cessium bomb going off your done.
I've been feeling funny since I went in that open crypt. Not sure what it is. |
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Giblet
Location: Atlanta
Gender: Male
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 16 on 10/8/2004 3:29 PM >
| | | | Posted by SLICKIS
Gamma is worse than alpha as alpha is much more short lived but if you breath an alpha particle say right after a cessium bomb going off your done.
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If you've ingested enough alpha particles (from any source) to sterilize you, your hair and teeth have already started to abandon the sinking ship. ie, You're in need of immediate, emergency medical attention - good luck. Yes, gamma is worser er.
One correction/addition to my post above:
Old radio transmitters use some really scary vacuum tubes (valves if you're British). These usually have lots of steel shielding around them because they emit X-Rays while operating. X-Ray exposure is another cumulative form of radiation you want to avoid whenever possible. So, if you salvage some gear from a certain-to-be-demolished-tomorrow transmitter, READ A FREAKING MANUAL before you 'Plug-er-in and see what she does!'.
Flash bulbs won't trigger on X-Rays unless the rays are so powerful as to be almost instantly lethal. ("Gak!" Thud Flash!)
Old tubes are the coolest. Don't let a wrecking ball smash them because many are irreplaceable. I never salvage anything unless the item's doom is guaranteed and it is obviously unwanted. YOU MUST ALWAYS ASK THE OWNER! They almost always say "Huhn? Oh yeah, sure. WTH do you want THAT for?" But please, don't permit these relics of primordial technology to be forever lost. I will buy them from the owner! But this is another topic I suppose.
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Slickis
Noble Donor
Location: Kokomo, Indiana
Gender: Male
Rest In Piece Booger 4-6-08
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 17 on 10/11/2004 7:00 AM >
| | | | I remember reading this at the link below.
"alpha can travel only a few feet and is incapable of penetrating human skin."
"Though the alpha particles cannot penetrate the skin, such radiation is extremely hazardous if inhaled or ingested, because Plutonium is the most toxic substance known to man. If you breathed in a mouthful immediately after the blast you would be dead in less than an hour, perhaps within minutes. If instead you breathed in a single microgram, you might last for as few months. Anything in-between is on a sliding scale."
http://homepage.nt...ali_micro_nuke.htm
I've been feeling funny since I went in that open crypt. Not sure what it is. |
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Giblet
Location: Atlanta
Gender: Male
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 18 on 10/11/2004 1:18 PM >
| | | | Nasty stuff. No doubt. Since this is half-on-topic, I'll relate some info about a site that may be abandoned soon:
In Miamisburg Ohio there's a site I'd love to explore -- with a full-on rad suit... There's the old Monsanto Mound plant up on the hill with triple loops of razor wire on three concentric fences, tank traps, guard tower/shacks that are/were manned by heavily armed DOE military personnel.
The DOE would probably get all ticked off if they caught someone running around taking pictures inside the fence. I don't know about now, but a few years ago, you'd get your film confiscated and questioned if you took any pictures from *outside* the fence. It is said the entire hill is riddled with tunnels and labs, but I think that's exaggerated.
NOTE: IF YOU TRY TO EXPLORE THIS PLACE, VERY BAD THINGS WILL HAPPEN TO YOU. MAYBE ARREST (if you are lucky), MAYBE CONTAMINATION, MAYBE A CELL IN GUANTANAMO BAY, CUBA. DON'T EVEN THINK ABOUT IT. YET.
The site was used to make warhead detonators, then they switched to power cells (for satellites, probes [eg Voyager], etc). I think it's in shutdown mode these days, owned by E.G.&G. but still under the wing of the DOE.
It's said these Monsanto clowns dropped several *grams* of plutonium down an open drain there (this is rumor, but from a source who'd know). Now, the whole valley below is hot. It was/is one of the top 20 sites on the SuperFund list because it polluted 10 miles of drainage ditch between Miamisburg and Franklin.
It's really creepy to see a back hoe picking up a bunch of public playground equipment and putting it in these big yellow DOE disposal canisters. At the end of the day they take the bucket and tires off the backhoe and haul THEM away too. Everyone in town witnessed this, yet I never saw a single news report about it. Understandably, the DOE can't let reporters film any of this stuff. But, a public playground...
Anyway, you don't usually find that stuff up on a radio tower, and that's what I think Beagle was getting at.
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Servo
| | Re: RF Radiadion
<Reply # 19 on 10/11/2004 6:49 PM >
| | | | My uncle worked at Mound... he passed away a few years ago. From lymphoma. I don't think I would want to be anywhere near the place either.
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