http://www.msnbc.m...iness-us_business/

I am very curious as to what you guys will think of this article. One one side, I don't doubt this lady's allegations. BUT - I am not convinced she handled it as well as she could have.

Let's do our best to not turn this into an argument on if her beliefs are right and stick to whether TSA should have fired this lady or not.

I don't bring my religion into the workplace unless I am asked about it.

If this developes into "wiccan equal rights", I'm outta here. I actually dated a wiccan... They do (or at least she did) "cast spells" or curses, or at least claim to. FUCK THAT!

Religion should have no place in the work place, its just not related to anything. She said she was proud to be a witch, sounds like she made it known she was a wiccan, her fault. You cant control what people think of you, but you can control what they know about you.

All the places I have worked at had no idea what my beliefs were, except for a couple close coworkers of similar beliefs. And I liked it that way, I also had no desire to know what other people believed around me.

If I were to let it be known what my beliefs are, Christian, Hind, Wicca, Islam, I better be prepared to be persecuted.

Also, I dont think anyone thinks positively of wiccans... I mean, they worship the devil for crying out loud, what good can come from that???

Should someone be fired for their beliefs? No. They should be fired if they cant perform their job properly or impair the work of others. And in this case, she was striking fear into other coworkers, making for a fear based work environment. If I was a manager, I would fire/review the person causing the fear and worries. Anything that impairs productivity or moral of employees, needs to be addressed and taken care of. In this case, you cant change a persons beliefs or how people perceive them, so you remove the problem. What other choice do you have???

I'm not a wiccan, but had a wiccan roomate. They do not worship the devil. They don't believe in the devil. At a teaparty I met a wiccan tea party member. She was as level headed a person I ever met. My roomate was a bit of, she was, well, off. But no, to clear it up, wiccans do not worship the devil, or christ, or God. Yes, they do practice "magic".

I think Wiccans are stupid.

that being said, though, you have to be really stupid if you think a Wiccan can cast a spell on you. is it wrong that she got fired for being a Wiccan? yes.

this story also confirms my belief that most people who practice wica are stupid kids or overweight cat ladies.

Posted by Mr_Fiend If this developes into "wiccan equal rights", I'm outta here. I actually dated a wiccan... They do (or at least she did) "cast spells" or curses, or at least claim to. FUCK THAT!

"Spells" are no different than prayers.

_{This should be an interesting discussion...}

Also, I dont think anyone thinks positively of wiccans... I mean, they worship the devil for crying out loud, what good can come from that???

Why am I not surprised to read this? I could say that the Devil does not even exist in Wiccan beliefs, but I doubt that would make a difference. You claimed to have dated a Wiccan. Logic would suggest you must have learned SOMETHING from her. Apparently not.



Now about the article:

She accused Smith of following her on the highway one snowy evening after work and casting a spell on the heater of her car, causing it not to work.

This is painfully stupid.

“He wanted me to go to ICMS and sit down with Mary and explain my religion to her,” Smith said. “I'm like, 'No.' I refused to do that. It's not up to me to teach her my religion. I mean, would I have to go down and sit with her if I was Jewish?”

She should have done this at least out of courtesy. She makes a point about not having to do that if she was Jewish, but if you run around calling yourself a witch while you're surrounded by thousands of people who have grown up seeing that "witch" is a bad thing, you're asking for trouble.

The bottom line: Firing someone for being Wiccan is just as illegal as firing someone for being Christian.

Educate yourselves. http://www.butler....dy-religion/wicca/

In 1986, a federal appeals court ruled that Wicca was a legal religion. Wicca is therefore now protected by the U.S. Constitution as are other religions.

Posted by MonkeyPunchBaby this story also confirms my belief that most people who practice wica are stupid kids or overweight cat ladies.

Or Lisa Simpson...

Posted by Oryx "Spells" are no different than prayers.

Yeah... Because spells are always harmless and have positive intentions.


And the Wiccan I dated didnt tell me much. I eventually learned enough to know she was bat shit crazy. I didnt stick around to get the details of her core beliefs, didn't need to.

Posted by Oryx "Spells" are no different than prayers.

Truth.


On the other side of this fence: Wicca was wiped out by the Christians. Almost completely. Most of it as it exists today is made up after the fact. It is dead and should remain such. Truth needs to be sought after. Not what other people thought was truth.

Posted by Mr_Fiend Yeah... Because spells are always harmless and have positive intentions.

That has to do more with the practitioner than the faith. Akin to: May god smite all my foes.

You are not a Christian. You have too much hate and misunderstand too much. You have not even read the bible. I have not either, but I don't claim to be a christian. If you say you have, then I ask this: Do you know how to read and understand Greek? No? Then STFU. Friend of mine is Jewish, and can read and understand Hebrew. He is also learning Aramaic and Greek.

Posted by dirt You are not a Christian. You have too much hate and misunderstand too much. You have not even read the bible. I have not either, but I don't claim to be a christian.

First off, you don't know what a Christian is.

Second, I've never actually said "I'm a Christian".

Thirdly, who are you to judge me??? Especially since you said YOU haven't even read the bible.

Take a walk sir.

This is yet another example of the Christian mafia.

Posted by Mr_Fiend Religion should have no place in the work place, its just not related to anything.

I think someone needs to tell this to politicians.

Posted by Mr_Fiend Should someone be fired for their beliefs? No. They should be fired if they cant perform their job properly or impair the work of others. And in this case, she was striking fear into other coworkers, making for a fear based work environment. If I was a manager, I would fire/review the person causing the fear and worries. Anything that impairs productivity or moral of employees, needs to be addressed and taken care of. In this case, you cant change a persons beliefs or how people perceive them, so you remove the problem. What other choice do you have???

I insist that all evangelicals be fired from my workplace. They certainly should be barred from being president (especially since their beliefs mandate bringing on the end of the world). In fact, I might be okay with burning them too.

Posted by Oryx She should have done this at least out of courtesy. She makes a point about not having to do that if she was Jewish, but if you run around calling yourself a witch while you're surrounded by thousands of people who have grown up seeing that "witch" is a bad thing, you're asking for trouble.

Very true. You have to put up with some stupid bullshit at work sometimes.

Posted by Mr_Fiend Yeah... Because spells are always harmless and have positive intentions.

Dude, seriously. Look into getting some help with your anger issues. You say you are full of love, but literally every other post of yours is spewing externalized hatred which is coming from somewhere. It's either from your God or from you.

Posted by Mr_Fiend First off, you don't know what a Christian is. Second, I've never actually said "I'm a Christian". Thirdly, who are you to judge me??? Especially since you said YOU haven't even read the bible. Take a walk sir.

This is terribly amusing. While reading the article and the description of her brand of Wicca, I actually thought of it as similar to your brand of Christianity. I actually thought that you might point this out yourself.

Apparently not.

And, I have read and studied the Bible, from beginning to end. It is an interesting collection of stuff.

Posted by MutantMandias Dude, seriously. Look into getting some help with your anger issues. You say you are full of love, but literally every other post of yours is spewing externalized hatred which is coming from somewhere. It's either from your God or from you.

When have I ever conveyed "hatred" or anger???? I'm not the one saying I want to see Christians burned. Maybe if you were without fault, I would take your criticism seriously.

Anyone else notice personal attacks on me without me starting them? Oh wait, it's ok to bash christians, nvm.

Stay on topic and get off my ass, please!

This is starting out great.

First of all, maybe do some research into Wicca before you go throwing out opinions. That attitude (Wiccans worship the devil, cast evil spells, blahblahblah) are what caused the problem for this woman in the first place.

Personally, I feel that she should not have been fired for her religion.

On the flip side, she should have expected some negativity when she told someone she was a witch, that is just something that people will not understand offhand and will likely not take too well unless they already have some knowledge of Wicca.

Then again, blame shitty management at TSA. I asked my husband, who is a manager and a Christian what he would have done in this case if it was happening in his store. Good thing he's logical. Asking for proof of any wrongdoing and offering the poor terribly frightened Christian victim a transfer to another department, considering that there was NO PROOF of violence or wrongdoing on the Wiccan's part.


As far as spells and prayers being the same:
Yeah... Because prayers are always harmless and have positive intentions.
Neither are too effective if you don't believe in them.

Posted by Mr_Fiend When have I ever conveyed "hatred" or anger????

I'm just restating what I have said a number of times before: you attribute everyone else's actions to hatred. It's very creepy.

Posted by Mr_Fiend I'm not the one saying I want to see Christians burned

Wow. Really? Do you not get the witch joke?

Posted by Mr_Fiend Maybe if you were without fault, I would take your criticism seriously.

So, you only take criticism from jebus. Gotcha.





There is a noticeable lack of anyone discussing the actual workplace harassment that happened here.

Oh wait, it's ok for Christians to bash anyone, nvm.

Posted by Mr_Fiend First off, you don't know what a Christian is. Second, I've never actually said "I'm a Christian". Thirdly, who are you to judge me??? Especially since you said YOU haven't even read the bible. Take a walk sir.

I don't know what a Christian is? Boy, do you assume much.

Shall I outline Christianity for you? First there was the old testament, And it outlined creation an all this other stuff like rules having to do with animal sacrifice and whatnot. Then Christ appeared on the scene. He did a bunch of stuff or had stuff attributed to him, then was crucified. His teaching spread by word of mouth from his followers. Much of "his" teachings were written down post death, and collected. Here is the fun part: Those who wanted to take power edited these teachings, destroying much of what didn't fit into their grand scheme. Things that would produce thinkers. See, these people wanted lambs. There have been a few of these teachings that survived, but the church will not recognize them. Because doing so would be admitting to wrong doing. That is backstory. A Christian is one who follows the words of "Christ".

Didn't need to outright out yourself. Enough is learned by what you say. So don't hide behind vagueness as if it gives strength. It doesn't.

Right, I didn't read the bible and neither have you. So we are in a stalemate in that regard. My Judgment comes from your passive beliefs and the stereotypes it creates in your mind. The unfounded hate that hides under this guise of love. You think you can save people. That you know better. THAT IS NOT LOVE. That is ego. Love and the way it operates shuns your thinking by the very fact of it being thought. Love acts from a place of trust and intimacy. With your views, you place distrust on the person and their own path.

Posted by dirt The unfounded hate that hides under this guise of love.

So what you're saying is that the bible and what it teaches is "hateful"? Because the teachings that I repeat are directly from the bible. But you wouldn't know because you haven't read it, but claim to know ALL, especially the history of Christ. Makes perfect sense. You just don't like it, so you call it hate.

Btw, this isn't about christianity, but you chose to go off on it and attack, who sounds more hateful here??

I love you, but you are very ignorant. I have my faults too, but you don't see me attacking who you are.

I'm done.

Posted by Mr_Fiend Also, I dont think anyone thinks positively of wiccans... I mean, they worship the devil for crying out loud, what good can come from that???

The Wiccans I've known have been fine people. I've had fewer problems with them than I have with Christians, but that's only my experience. They don't worship the devil. Those would be "Satanists." And in the US, you can worship whatever you want, as long as it doesn't infringe on the rights of others. So even Satanists can't be discriminated against in the workplace.

"Spells" are no different than prayers

QFT.

Posted by Mr_Fiend Btw, this isn't about christianity, but you chose to go off on it and attack

This is the religion section of UER. I could start a thread on Jediism and within 5 posts it will turn into nonstop bitching and bashing on Christianity.

Its just how it works.