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UER Forum > UE Main > Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer (Viewed 8656 times)
Explorer Zero 


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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 40 on 4/22/2020 11:57 PM >
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Posted by Thinklikefreak


I liked this post!

Yup indeed I am done here! I will never be back. Peace Ya'll.


Wow Sam youre being mean to the new people, just like the people you despise

you done r u n n him o f t




Boffo 

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 41 on 4/23/2020 1:30 AM >
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Posted by Thinklikefreak


I liked this post!

Yup indeed I am done here! I will never be back. Peace Ya'll.

This is the third time they've self closed their account. They'll be back.




Here's a lockpick. It might be handy if you, the master of unlocking, take it with you.
RescueMe1060 


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Radioactivity, its in the air for you & me

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 42 on 4/23/2020 1:46 AM >
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^^ so that profile really was our old friend MtnManDan and the girl he shares all 8 of his profiles with?




http://www.flickr....rescueme1060/sets/
Max Power @strangeplaces 


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I do it for the views *Specializes in stealing Nazi VHS tapes from Nazi monuments for the views*

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 43 on 4/23/2020 2:47 AM >
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Posted by Boffo
I disagree that there isn't an urban exploration community. I have explored with different people who I would have never interacted with save for our common interest in urban exploration. I have hosted people from thousands of miles away and visited people thousands of miles away, this is absolutely a community.

I don't understand why you feel the need to justify yourself to the members at UER. For those who have been exploring for decades you are hard pressed to receive their praise, recognition, or interest. In the same way that I have never watched any of your videos or follow any exploring themed instagram page outside of landing on one while doing online research.

I choose not to engage with large parts of the urban exploration community. When people link me youtube videos of abandoned buildings I find them incredibly boring and have zero interest in watching them. That isn't to say there isn't currently a whole group of people who didn't get their start from instagram or youtube. Like many others (including yourself) I started exploring without knowing there was an online community. But I was happy there was one. When I started exploring Infiltration was still publishing zines and UER was a very different place due to the quality and prohibitively high cost of cameras and camcorders available.

I have seen pristine locations destroyed by explorers, vandals, arsonists, and development. I actively try and prevent my actions from accelerating that process and encourage others to do the same: Take only photos, leave only footprints and usufruct (the right to enjoy the use and advantages of another's property short of the destruction or waste of its substance) being two primary examples. My ethics do not align with fame-seekers and people trying to monetize urban exploring at the expense of locations. Just remember that to some parts of the community you might be hot shit in a champagne glass. But to others you're just diarrhea in a dixie cup. And it's up to you to decide if you care or not.

I grew out of the desire for peer validation and I guarantee you will too. That said I do occasionally still choose to contribute to the LDB because I like it and as a moderator I feel somewhat obligated.


Why did you bold the whole thing? It was incredibly difficult to read.


I appreciate you and so many others reading the entire post.

What I was trying to get at is that urbex has a culture, but isn't a culture in itself. I'm not trying to split hairs here, but urbex culture is separate from the activity of urban exploring, which originated from the loss of unexplored territory (for those of you who didn't read it I traced the origins of urban exploration to the exploration of the world throughout human history, and prehistory). I was making the point that no one owns, or invented urban exploration.

Posted by Aran
I think that one place I disagree with you is your statement that "urbex is not a subculture." It absolutely is. There exists a "core" community that had been doing this for decades, during which time they have created their own countercultural movement.


Arran I also appreciate that you took the time to read the entire thing.

You said that urban explorers "(created) their own countercultural movement.." This is correct, but the culture had be created. Urban exploration in itself was never created. The activity is an evolution of the exploration of the world, something we've been doing for thousands of years.

I bring-up these points for a few reasons.

1. Simply because people participate in urban exploration, and a lot of people aren't quite sure why, and I think many of the reasons are illustrated in my article. I think it;s an interesting conversation and discussion to be had.

2. In the first half I explain why people aren't simply exploiting a subculture because people don't realize there is a subculture to be exploited. They explore from impulses that come from within themselves.

Also, I don't understand why everyone thinks everything I do is about validation lol. I didn't write this article to receive validation from people on this site, I wrote it because I wanted to explain that my side of the community is not being driven 100% by profits, or by likes. We actually enjoy what we do.

And this article was partially a last-ditch effort to try and bridge the ever growing divide between the new generation and the old. In Chicago especially there have been several conflicts between these two groups. The conflicts almost turned violent after fake accounts began leaking the addresses of my crew members and, as well as giving out private information of my crew's families (if you want I can give you the whole story). The other side also wanted us to, "pull up," but they never gave us an address, and just blocked everyone.

In the past they also hacked my (now ex) girlfriend's instagram. It seems like Chicago is always the center of the confrontation, but they occur elsewhere as well.

The clearly malicious intent of some of these individuals is giving everyone on the opposite side of the community a bad name. Everyone who has complaints now are now simply labeled as "haters," because we can't really tell the haters from people who have legitimate concerns.

During the latest confrontation for example, I decided to have a conversation over the phone with someone who simply wanted us to stop posting instagram stories when we go to locations so that the whole world doesn't know the location is open/accessible. This was the day after the fake accounts leaked all this information, and I originally was very hostile to this individual until I realized that he wasn't a guy trying to start shit online, he actually cared about Chicago area spots, and he was asking for something extremely reasonable. His crew and ours pretty much came to an agreement that we wouldn't post stories until at least a few weeks/months after we visited a location.

These are the sort of things that I think need to happen between the two factions of this community. I don't think this level of hostility should continue.

I wrote this so that this side of the community can understand where we are coming from so maybe we don't have to be as hostile towards one another. On my end of the community I've become somewhat influential, and it would seem irresponsible if I didn't at least try and get people to at least partially chill out. It'd be more productive if we could be civil towards one another.

And btw if I just wanted online attention, shit I would just walk around downtown Chicago in a speedo while its snowing and put that on the internet. But that'd be stupid, boring, and it wouldn't really be a creative challenge.










Take nothing but Nazi VHS tapes, leave nothing but footprints, drink nothing but Dos Equis. Stay thirsty my friends.
Deuterium 


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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 44 on 4/23/2020 3:08 AM >
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Posted by randomesquephoto
Why don't you simply just monetize on Onlyfans.com? Better to whore yourself out, than spots. Come on now.


Sound advice. He could put his filming, desire for subscribers and views into use and only affects himself if shit hits the fan.




Cosmic 


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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 45 on 4/23/2020 3:33 AM >
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Posted by Max Power @strangeplaces
Urban Exploration—Not a Culture, but an Instinct
By Maximilien Z. Power





You are a hype beast of the UE world and you know far less than you think you do about UE.





"ghost" 


Location: Colorado
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I climb. I jump. I explore.

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 46 on 4/23/2020 3:53 AM >
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I am not new to exploring, but I am new to the exploration culture. I never even thought to look for other people who did what I did, I just made my own plans and did my own things exactly as I felt they should be done. Now that I'm learning more about this (very real) community that exists, I believe I'm in an interesting position to weigh in. I suppose I fall into the "preservationist" category, although fuck titles and expectations; real life doesn't work that way. I've never had any social media accounts and I despise their vanity.

Posted by Max Power @strangeplaces
2. In the first half I explain why people aren't simply exploiting a subculture because people don't realize there is a subculture to be exploited. They explore from impulses that come from within themselves.

Sure, so maybe some people, like me, had no idea the culture existed. But here I am; I cared enough about urbex to do 5min of googling and landed on this site very easily. It's not hard to find.

Posted by Max Power @strangeplaces
Also, I don't understand why everyone thinks everything I do is about validation lol. I didn't write this article to receive validation from people on this site, I wrote it because I wanted to explain that my side of the community is not being driven 100% by profits, or by likes. We actually enjoy what we do.

I don't doubt that you enjoy what you do, we're all here because we enjoy it, right? If not, why the hell are you reading this right now? The center of this issue is a cost vs benefit analysis between what you're getting out of the publicity and the cost that's taking it's toll on the community locations. There's a discrepancy there - you're drawing personal benefit at the cost of a community resource; you can't expect that community to be happy about it.

I don't think doxxing is ever okay and I'm sorry that happened to you and your crew. There are crazies on every side, I really do feel for you.

Here's the philosophy I learned and adopted from the Leave No Trace program: "What if 100 people did exactly as I did? What would the impact be?" In this case the publicity you bring to locations behaves very similarly to pollution in the environment. You're setting an example that others will follow, and the effects of that can be devastating.




jonrev 


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Observer of obsolesence

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 47 on 4/23/2020 5:53 PM >
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Posted by Max Power @strangeplaces
Conquest (for lack of a better term) vs. preservation—that is where our riff lies.


The word you're searching for is narcissism.




[jonrevProjects] | Flickr flicks
Founder: Belvidere Cinema Gallery - Waukegan, IL
Radio2600 


Location: On the Road to Wellville
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HY KAK TO TAK

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 48 on 4/24/2020 2:09 AM >
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Posted by jonrev


The word you're searching for is narcissism.


+1






[last edit 4/24/2020 2:10 AM by Radio2600 - edited 1 times]

In order to use your head, you have to go out of your mind.
taragon 


Location: Minneapolis
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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 49 on 4/24/2020 2:25 AM >
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I don't really have time to type much else, but this is a big oversimplification of both colonialism and UE.




Beebs 


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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 50 on 4/24/2020 2:53 AM >
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dont worry, I gotchu guys

https://www.youtub...atch?v=ZpblcWwG5fo




Strange places with Max Power and Free4All, also Eric and Myles
Aran 


Location: Kansas City
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Huh. I guess covid made me a trendsetter.

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 51 on 4/24/2020 5:18 AM >
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Posted by Beebs
dont worry, I gotchu guys

https://www.youtub...atch?v=ZpblcWwG5fo


Whatever your opinion of Max doxxing somebody is unethical as hell. I personally would see somebody who doesn't like me releasing both my and my family's real names and home addresses online as an implicit threat, and that's not the kind of behavior we should tolerate in this community.




"Sorry, I didn't know I'm not supposed to be here," he said, knowing full well he wasn't supposed to be there.

Steed 


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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 52 on 4/24/2020 5:28 AM >
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Posted by Aran


Whatever your opinion of Max doxxing somebody is unethical as hell. I personally would see somebody who doesn't like me releasing both my and my family's real names and home addresses online as an implicit threat, and that's not the kind of behavior we should tolerate in this community.


Do they dox someone in the video? Not gonna watch it.




Aran 


Location: Kansas City
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Huh. I guess covid made me a trendsetter.

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 53 on 4/24/2020 5:31 AM >
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Posted by Steed


Do they dox someone in the video? Not gonna watch it.


No, but Max claims that several people who didn't like him doxxed him under throwaway Instagram accounts. Given the amount of hate he garners here and how seriously many explorers take location secrecy it wouldn't surprise me at all if it's true. I've heard whispers of similar stories in years passed.




"Sorry, I didn't know I'm not supposed to be here," he said, knowing full well he wasn't supposed to be there.

Boffo 

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 54 on 4/24/2020 5:34 AM >
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Posted by Aran
...that's not the kind of behavior we should tolerate in this community.

If they're even actively on UER, more often than not big cities like New York, Twin Cities, Detroit, etc. have their own cliques and rarely visit UER.




Here's a lockpick. It might be handy if you, the master of unlocking, take it with you.
Max Power @strangeplaces 


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I do it for the views *Specializes in stealing Nazi VHS tapes from Nazi monuments for the views*

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 55 on 4/24/2020 6:34 AM >
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Posted by Aran


No, but Max claims that several people who didn't like him doxxed him under throwaway Instagram accounts. Given the amount of hate he garners here and how seriously many explorers take location secrecy it wouldn't surprise me at all if it's true. I've heard whispers of similar stories in years passed.


It definitely wasn't one of my haters from UER lol. The word on the street is its this guy from another crew that hates us with a passion. But even if it isn't, people from UER are the last on our suspect list for this incident. It was bad, they came after my friends Esmae and Jose too.





Take nothing but Nazi VHS tapes, leave nothing but footprints, drink nothing but Dos Equis. Stay thirsty my friends.
Aran 


Location: Kansas City
Gender: Male
Total Likes: 1839 likes


Huh. I guess covid made me a trendsetter.

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 56 on 4/24/2020 7:01 AM >
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Posted by Max Power @strangeplaces


It definitely wasn't one of my haters from UER lol. The word on the street is its this guy from another crew that hates us with a passion. But even if it isn't, people from UER are the last on our suspect list for this incident. It was bad, they came after my friends Esmae and Jose too.




Well that's good at least. I didn't want to think anybody here would do that but your initial statement was kinda vague. Ah well, that shit (among other reasons) is exactly why I avoid the Instagram urbex drama like the plague.




"Sorry, I didn't know I'm not supposed to be here," he said, knowing full well he wasn't supposed to be there.

Steed 


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Gender: Male
Total Likes: 2650 likes


Your Friendly Neighbourhood Race Traitor

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 57 on 4/24/2020 8:54 AM >
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Posted by Max Power @strangeplaces


It definitely wasn't one of my haters from UER lol. The word on the street is its this guy from another crew that hates us with a passion. But even if it isn't, people from UER are the last on our suspect list for this incident. It was bad, they came after my friends Esmae and Jose too.




By crew, you mean film crew, right? Seems kind of pointless to breech the privacy of someone who puts their face all over YouTube.




Explorer Zero 


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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 58 on 4/24/2020 11:06 AM >
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Posted by Steed


By crew, you mean film crew, right? Seems kind of pointless to breech the privacy of someone who puts their face all over YouTube.


LOL no kiddin…


Exactly




Samurai 

Vehicular Lord Rick


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No matter where you go, there you are...

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Re: Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer
< Reply # 59 on 4/24/2020 12:36 PM >
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Posted by Explorer Zero


Wow Sam youre being mean to the new people, just like the people you despise

you done r u n n him o f t


sorry.
I didn't like his tone or attitude.
I probably could've expressed my displeasure at his comments in a more polite or diplomatic fashion, but fuck that. That's not who I am. If you come off like a fucktard, I am going to call you out on it in the most terse fashion.







UER Forum > UE Main > Urban Exploration Doesn't Exist, and Never Has--Thoughts from A Controversial Explorer (Viewed 8656 times)
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