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UER Forum > Rookie Forum > When do you need to wear a mask? (Viewed 12757 times)
ZAZ 


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When do you need to wear a mask?
< on 8/15/2016 5:25 AM >
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Hey so I read how wearing a mask while exploring in certain buildings is recommended. What signs should I look for to decide if i need to wear a mask or not?




DarkAngel 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 1 on 8/15/2016 9:14 AM >
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All the signs that point to mold, high humidity, standing water, rotting wood, that kind of stuff is an immediate hint.

Old buildings (pre ~1980) I'd wear a mask as the odds are pretty high there is asbestos present.

Those two are the biggest concerns at least, but it does change a lot depending on where you are going, what the structure is like, airflow, etc.

Lot of variables that can fuck you up or save your ass. Also remember to match your filter to the area you are going in. Particulate filters won't stop vapors, oily vapors will clog regular filters, etc.



[last edit 8/15/2016 9:15 AM by DarkAngel - edited 1 times]

mookster 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 2 on 8/15/2016 4:11 PM >
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And don't forget a mask is only good up to a point if there is free floating broken asbestos lying around. It may protect your lungs but you will carry those fibres on your clothes, your shoes, your hair, everywhere you go. Which will then get transferred into your car, onto other people, your pets, your belongings.

If you're in a building that has obvious signs of recently broken up asbestos with airborne fibres it's best to avoid the place entirely. If the place is wet or damp, fibres are usually trapped at ground level by moisture so unless you go purposefully kicking up the dust you'll be alright. White asbestos which was commonly used in buildings pre 1980 is absolutely fine if it is intact and undisturbed and left alone.

It's the black mould and pigeon shit you need to be worried about before asbestos.



[last edit 8/15/2016 4:11 PM by mookster - edited 1 times]

blackhawk 

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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 3 on 8/15/2016 5:10 PM >
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Posted by mookster
And don't forget a mask is only good up to a point if there is free floating broken asbestos lying around. It may protect your lungs but you will carry those fibres on your clothes, your shoes, your hair, everywhere you go. Which will then get transferred into your car, onto other people, your pets, your belongings.

If you're in a building that has obvious signs of recently broken up asbestos with airborne fibres it's best to avoid the place entirely. If the place is wet or damp, fibres are usually trapped at ground level by moisture so unless you go purposefully kicking up the dust you'll be alright. White asbestos which was commonly used in buildings pre 1980 is absolutely fine if it is intact and undisturbed and left alone.

It's the black mould and pigeon shit you need to be worried about before asbestos.


Spot on. Avoid heavy contaminated asbestos especially if dry.
I never wear a respirator anymore expect for work. If I need one to play... it ain't play!

Pigeon shit is a special hazard. The fungal infection it can carry can lay you up for weeks... been there sick as hell for 5 weeks.
Hauntavirus will kill you. Be very wary of heavily rodent infested areas.
Black mold spores will cling to -everything-

If the area is so heavily contaminated that you need a respirator; you need additional equipment, and training. Avoid it or at least don't stir up dust.
For biological pathogens keeping your hands away from your face is a must. A simple 3m paper mask can keep you from contracting disease in pigeon shit cake and rodent infested/nesting areas. Avoid touching objects in them and especially stirring up dust! Active hantavirus can be in dried rodent urine and feces... an extreme inhalation and mucous membrane contact biohazard in eastern and southern USA.




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heinrick 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 4 on 8/15/2016 5:54 PM >
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When you want to look like a tool.




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LongLegs 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 5 on 8/15/2016 5:57 PM >
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If you think you should wear a mask, wear a mask. Don't listen to anyone who tells you to not wear one, its better safe than sorry. Mold, asbestos, you can usually tell if an area is contaminated by looking around. If your breathing starts feeling off or laboured, wear it. Better to have a slightly sweaty face than Mesothelioma in 20 years.

http://www.uer.ca/...=104366&currpage=1




mookster 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 6 on 8/15/2016 6:46 PM >
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Posted by heinrick
When you want to look like a tool.


I was going to say the third option is to wear a silly mask for ridiculous urbex selfies.




smokedguadacheese 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 7 on 8/15/2016 6:49 PM >
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I would wear a respirator if I was in a deodorant animal/human testing laboratory. Or if I was exploring a disease research facility.




DarkAngel 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 8 on 8/15/2016 6:51 PM >
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Posted by blackhawk


Spot on. Avoid heavy contaminated asbestos especially if dry.
I never wear a respirator anymore expect for work. If I need one to play... it ain't play!

Pigeon shit is a special hazard. The fungal infection it can carry can lay you up for weeks... been there sick as hell for 5 weeks.
Hauntavirus will kill you. Be very wary of heavily rodent infested areas.
Black mold spores will cling to -everything-

If the area is so heavily contaminated that you need a respirator; you need additional equipment, and training. Avoid it or at least don't stir up dust.
For biological pathogens keeping your hands away from your face is a must. A simple 3m paper mask can keep you from contracting disease in pigeon shit cake and rodent infested/nesting areas. Avoid touching objects in them and especially stirring up dust! Active hantavirus can be in dried rodent urine and feces... an extreme inhalation and mucous membrane contact biohazard in eastern and southern USA.


Huh, I didn't know that. Outside the heart of the city, we don't have pigeons up here for the most part. I'll have to keep that in mind. Good tip.




blackhawk 

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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 9 on 8/15/2016 7:03 PM >
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Pigeons are the flying sewer of the animal world.
Rats with wings. I hate them and drop kick em whenever possible
http://www.azwns.c...hchart_pigeons.htm




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blackhawk 

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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 10 on 8/15/2016 7:32 PM >
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Posted by LongLegs
If you think you should wear a mask, wear a mask. Don't listen to anyone who tells you to not wear one, its better safe than sorry. Mold, asbestos, you can usually tell if an area is contaminated by looking around. If your breathing starts feeling off or laboured, wear it. Better to have a slightly sweaty face than Mesothelioma in 20 years.

http://www.uer.ca/...=104366&currpage=1


I've used respirators, air hoods, and SCBAs for almost 40 years. They are a pain and the last line of defense; it's far better to avoid the hazard it's self. You need to be trained, fit tested, and have the appropriate mask/filters for this PPE to be effective and safe.

If your breathing becomes labored you don't put on a respirator; immediately leave the area and rest. A respirator can over strain someone already fatigue.

Respirators are fatiguing in themselves and can turn into a distraction especially in hot, humid environments. Most reduce your field of vision especially downward.
If you fall in a hellhole, the results are instant...

The thread you hyperlinked; the OP may not like being made into the poster child for the hazards of UE.
He did not have Mesothelioma.
I think it's in very poor taste to rehash his misfortune.
It's his story to tell if -he- cares to.




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LongLegs 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 11 on 8/15/2016 7:59 PM >
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Posted by blackhawk

The thread you hyperlinked; the OP may not like being made into the poster child for the hazards of UE.
He did not have Mesothelioma.
I think it's in very poor taste to rehash his misfortune.
It's his story to tell if -he- cares to.



I'm not using OP as an example. He titled his OWN thread "Public Service Announcement". I'm spreading the word, that was one of the first things I saw on this site. I didn't say he has mesothelioma, asbestos causes mesothelioma, or didn't you already know that? He already told his story, as you know, he kinda made an entire thread on it.




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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 12 on 8/15/2016 8:27 PM >
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Posted by LongLegs


I'm not using OP as an example. He titled his OWN thread "Public Service Announcement". I'm spreading the word, that was one of the first things I saw on this site. I didn't say he has mesothelioma, asbestos causes mesothelioma, or didn't you already know that? He already told his story, as you know, he kinda made an entire thread on it.


That was years ago (hint).
He was explaining more why he was/would be gone to people that knew him.
I know personally I don't think or even want to be reminded of my prolonged and painful illnesses every day.
Got a dead mother or something you like to talk about?

Humans have evolved over millions of years in dusty, dirty environments. The human body will tolerate and even thrive on a certain amount of toxins and dirt. A respirator is more useful with biohazards that may be present and are immediately life threatening. In most cases the disadvantages of a respirator when exploring out way the advantages.

Your number one threat are falls and structural collapses. A respirator reduces downward visibility and even workers who use them everyday sometimes trip because of this. In unfamiliar surroundings this becomes even more of an issue. Respirators are taxing both physically and mentally. Nothing fun or cool about them

If you're really worried about Mesothelioma and lung cancer, never smoke or be around second hand smoke *lites cigar*



[last edit 8/15/2016 8:54 PM by blackhawk - edited 2 times]

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LongLegs 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 13 on 8/15/2016 8:40 PM >
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Posted by blackhawk


That was years ago (hint).
He was explaining more why he was/would be gone to people that knew him.
I know personally I don't think or even want to be reminded of my prolonged and painful illnesses every day.
Got a dead mother or something you like to talk about?



Sorry, my mistake for trying to add a helpful very serious piece of advice. I don't know him personally as you do, but I don't intend any disrespect or bad will and I figure if it's still on the forums, it'll let newer guys, like me, be aware of how serious UE can be.

It seems like the second anybody that doesn't have more than 5 years on this site tries to help someone, they're immediately discredited and told to politely shut up. Don't jump down peoples throats all the time, not everyone is trying to be malicious.



[last edit 8/15/2016 8:41 PM by LongLegs - edited 1 times]

blackhawk 

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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 14 on 8/16/2016 12:32 AM >
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Posted by zaz3494
What signs should I look for to decide if i need to wear a mask or not?


It's more a question of if you go in at all. If scrappers have torn out copper steam return lines and left the asbestos insulation everywhere, walk away especially if it's not wetted down.
If marked for abatement it may not pose much of a hazard if it's just floor or ceiling tiles and it's intact. A lot of dry fine debris and wind is a potentially worse situation. Assume that all dust contains asbestos.
Avoid dusty locations and kicking up dust. When you do get away from it and let it settle.

To properly ID asbestos you need a microscope but by handling it you can pretty much tell many times. Unlike glass fibers, asbestos fibers aren't solid and uniform in diameter. The fibers readily split apart to form finer fibers. Color is not a reliable indicator. The batting may also ID it or at least tell you it's fiberglass. Expanded vermiculite insulation is known to sometimes contain asbestos; it occurs naturally in some deposits. Also understand asbestos was mixed with other materials or used as a filler and may not be readily discernible.
Regardless you don't what a nose full of fiberglass either and it has known health hazards.
Breathe through your nose; it will filter some dust out. Don't over exert yourself, this isn't a race. If you're breathing through your mouth, you need to slow down. This is true with a respirator too.

If you insist on going into a heavily contaminated site with the appropriate fit tested respirator and filters you'll still have take it off when done.
All your clothes will be contaminated, so will your hair unless you covered it. Leave respirator on until you stripped butt naked outside, bag your boots, and throw the clothes. Even if you wear a Tyvex suit consider the clothes contaminated. Clean the boots latter with a water hose and/or shop vac; you did wear high top boots, right? Best to time off your pants to the boot at the top.

Vacuum everything else with a shop vac with a HEPA filter on it. Throw the respirators filters and thoroughly clean the respirator with a damp cloth.

You should always wear glasses on site; protect your eyes. Keep your hands away from your eyes while at the site.

Remember inhaling a small amount asbestos, silica etc. probably wouldn't harm you.
One fall or structural collapse can instantly change or end your life.




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smokedguadacheese 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 15 on 8/16/2016 12:39 AM >
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A very clear sign you will want a respirator is if you see raccoons and chipmunks on site with extra limbs or additional eyeballs. Also if there are like dead or alive zombies then definitely wear one or better just stay out.




red utricle 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 16 on 8/17/2016 1:13 AM >
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Posted by blackhawk
Also understand asbestos was mixed with other materials or used as a filler and may not be readily discernible.



Asbestos has been used in a huge range of products. It really is a great material, besides you know ... that pesky side effect of killing people and animals that were often exposed to it.

Check out the wikipedia page https://en.wikiped...y_and_product_type for a list of common uses

Posted by blackhawk
Remember inhaling a small amount asbestos, silica etc. probably wouldn't harm you.



As someone in the medical field, I would err on the side of caution. Especially in poorly ventilated areas, as asbestos can stay suspended in air for long periods of time. And mesothelioma is a hell I never want to experience.




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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 17 on 8/17/2016 1:59 AM >
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Posted by red utricle


Asbestos has been used in a huge range of products. It really is a great material, besides you know ... that pesky side effect of killing people and animals that were often exposed to it.

Check out the wikipedia page https://en.wikiped...y_and_product_type for a list of common uses



As someone in the medical field, I would err on the side of caution. Especially in poorly ventilated areas, as asbestos can stay suspended in air for long periods of time. And mesothelioma is a hell I never want to experience.


It's an incredible substance; a thermal and electrical insulator, with extreme breakdown resistance to extreme temperatures.
Moisture doesn't degrade it and it is impervious to many caustics and acids.
It can readily be woven into fabric and rope like insulation.
Old welders used a pad of it the insulate to themselves from cold surfaces. It's an excellent insulator... yes well.

It's best to avoid it, but that is impossible. The amount ingested and if a person smokes are what really matters.
Light exposures are without consequence in most cases, even for smokers. Those with heavy exposures don't fare as well. However even than not all with heavy exposures become disabled or die from it.
The type also matters; Chrysotile or blue asbestos is the most dangerous and is unfortunately the most common.
https://en.m.wikip...rg/wiki/Chrysotile

http://www.asbesto...estos-Fibers.shtml




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DarkAngel 


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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 18 on 8/17/2016 2:41 AM >
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Posted by blackhawk


It's an incredible substance; a thermal and electrical insulator, with extreme breakdown resistance to extreme temperatures.
Moisture doesn't degrade it and it is impervious to many caustics and acids.
It can readily be woven into fabric and rope like insulation.
Old welders used a pad of it the insulate to themselves from cold surfaces. It's an excellent insulator... yes well.

It's best to avoid it, but that is impossible. The amount ingested and if a person smokes are what really matters.
Light exposures are without consequence in most cases, even for smokers. Those with heavy exposures don't fare as well. However even than not all with heavy exposures become disabled or die from it.
The type also matters; Chrysotile or blue asbestos is the most dangerous and is unfortunately the most common.
https://en.m.wikip...rg/wiki/Chrysotile

http://www.asbesto...estos-Fibers.shtml


I've always wondered why they couldn't impregnate the fabric with a resin or something after laying it. That way it's not a dust hazard but still keeps the extreme majority of insulation properties.

That said, I never had to deal with abatement either so YMMV. Dad and friends have, but I didn't go construction and hazwopr.




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Re: When do you need to wear a mask?
< Reply # 19 on 8/17/2016 1:30 PM >
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Posted by DarkAngel


I've always wondered why they couldn't impregnate the fabric with a resin or something after laying it. That way it's not a dust hazard but still keeps the extreme majority of insulation properties.

That said, I never had to deal with abatement either so YMMV. Dad and friends have, but I didn't go construction and hazwopr.



Well they did many times seal it in or when used as a filler it was effectively sealed in. Unfortunately asbestos is almost immortal and sooner or latter what's binding it breaks down or is disturbed. Sealing it doesn't protect those who mine and process it though and they bore/bear the brunt of the risk.

Years back you could smell the burning binders and asbestos in brake shoes and clutches at times going down the highway. Mechanics say the burnt or dead asbestos isn't as harmful. Even though it's not used in clutch and brake products anymore... it's everywhere.




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UER Forum > Rookie Forum > When do you need to wear a mask? (Viewed 12757 times)
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