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 MatC
     
Nobler Donor
Location: ENY
Gender: Male
Accepted everywhere
 |  |  | Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
< on 8/15/2004 1:18 AM >
|  | | | There’s been a lot of talk on here recently about the reasons why one might engage in urban exploration. The argument was put forth that UE’ing is just for fun and no other purpose, but I think that’s a simplistic way to look at it. Certainly fun *is* one of the reasons to go UE’ing, but I would argue that there are any number of reasons to explore buildings, drains, roofs, catacombs, or wherever else your curiosity draws you. I’ll present the main reasons I think that people engage in this hobby and I’d be interested to hear what other people think.
1. Fun – Certainly, fun is a major motivation for a lot of UE’ing. This is especially true of people who UE in groups or teams, or who attend conferences like OPEx or the MochiMeets. It’s fun to meet people who enjoy the same hobby that you do. It’s fun to hang out with them and bring them (or have them bring you) to cool abandoned (or active) places. For some people it may even be fun to do crazy things while at sites – dressing up in clothes found there, playing with found objects, or just plain clowning around for the camera. Which brings me to...
2. Photography – Lots of people combine UE’ing with a passion for, or at least an interest in, documenting the places they visit through visual means (usually digital or traditional photography, but sometimes through video or other means). Arguably this photographic interest is twofold. Some people take pictures simply as a record of where they’ve been – a scrapbook of sorts. They take pictures of the places to remember them by and to prove to others that they’ve been there (one signature I’ve seen here on UER says something like, “if you don’t have pictures, you weren’t there.” Some people take their interest in photography beyond documentation, though. These people find beauty in the abandoned, the subterranean, the stark, the cluttered and (sometimes) the disgusting and dirty. They range from people who use regular cameras to take shots which are “artsy” in nature to people who visit sites almost exclusively for photographic purposes, sometimes bringing in valuable, sophisticated equipment to aid in their pursuit. These people are sometimes much more interested in documenting a site through photographs than exploring every inch of a site simply to have been there, and as such they are generally less concerned about the “ninja” aspects of UE. Speaking of which, there's...
3. Transgression – It is an undeniable fact that UE’ers are trespassers. We laugh at warning signs and pass over, around, under and sometimes through barriers installed to keep the general public at bay. Some people find this aspect to be very appealing, sometimes even seeking out the “rush” that comes from hiding/running from security or law enforcement, infiltrating live sites where the possibility of discovery is very high, or simply going somewhere that, legally, they are not supposed to go. This aspect of the hobby, for obvious reasons, tends to (but does not always) appeal to younger explorers as well as to those who dislike authority, who despise frivolous rules, and perhaps even those with a desire to transgress against societal norms, whatever they may be. Perhaps for this reason, another possible appeal of UE is...
4. Darker motives – This covers such areas as tagging, destruction of property, arson, theft, and other unkind words. It has been argued that people who do these things are not explorers because they break certain codes to which “real” explorers adhere, but it has also been put forth that perhaps everyone who explores is an explorer, it’s just that some of them also happen to steal, burn, tag, or whatever else. Whatever the reason, it is generally assumed that people who do these things tend not to explore for reasons of...
5. Historical interest – Some people seek out highly historical sites, including decommissioned military bases, vintage properties, and other sites with long and/or interesting histories which people seek to be a part of. This can perhaps best be encapsulated in the phrase, “and this is where it all happened...” Following close on the heels of historical interest is...
6. Human interest – Some people (myself included) enjoy exploring places which have a certain reflective quality about them, such as abandoned hospitals (mental health or otherwise), places of work (malls, mills, office buildings), or perhaps even former residences (hotels, apartment complexes). These sites tend to have an air about them which is familiar from one’s daily interactions with working versions of them, but which then ring hollow in a strange way due to their abandoned state. They also lend themselves well to storytelling and speculation – making up narratives about how certain objects got to be where they are, what certain rooms were used for, who the previous occupants might have been, etc. And speaking of previous occupants, we can’t forget those who engage in...
7. Seeking the paranormal – For better or for worse, aged or abandoned locations tend to have a reputation for being haunted, possessing strange qualities, or otherwise being worthy of investigation for paranormal activity. The debate over whether these types of phenomena exist is fodder for a different thread, so instead I will finish by mentioning...
8. Sometimes there’s no reason at all – Why do anything, after all? Why not sit at home all the time in a darkened room and do nothing at all? One has to do something with one’s life, so why not explore? I guess this could be called, “exploring for exploring’s sake,” or having a new experience, or perhaps being driven by simple curiosity.
And, as I’m sure you can tell, this list is far from inclusive. There are undoubtedly gradations of all of these reasons, and more, which motivate people to go exploring and to keep exploring. But ever since I started doing UE (and especially since I found that there was a whole community of people who do it, in different ways) I have been compelled to seek out the reasons for it. UE is a strange amalgam of a sport, a hobby, a pastime and an activity, and so it has been one of my goals to try to get a handle on what draws people to it.
I would appreciate any input anybody can offer on these points.
-- Mat
[last edit 8/15/2004 1:25 AM by MatC - edited 1 times]
"We shall not cease from exploration / And the end of all our exploring / Will be to arrive where we started / And know the place for the first time."
- T.S. Eliot, excerpt from "Little Gidding" |
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'Dukes
Noble Donor
Gender: Male
At least someone llikes me
| |  | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 1 on 8/15/2004 1:28 AM >
| | | | Myself; historical. I get some serious entertainment when I get to see a place such as National lead. If I didn't know the history it wouldn't be as exciting;
Aiden Lair; we were cold, it sucked but we were retracing Ted R's steps to the presidency.
Hudson River Psych; I know very little about the place and I ended up feeling like a criminal, especially after we got busted looking for a point of ingress. For us it's easy. To get ejected made us question our motives.
I don't think I should ever have to "run away" from anhyone.If the site has that much security than I don't belong there.
I got your tour winner right here pussies, at least he'd crash out trying. |
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Mark
Very Noble Donor
Location: South Carolina
Gender: Male
What is a lion, king of the savannah, when hes at the south pole?
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 2 on 8/15/2004 1:41 AM >
| | | | Great post Matt. I should have said that in my UE beginer thing. Thats a good well thought out list.
"If the threat level goes up its probably because of me." "I am looking for a girl who enjoys headbutting beltbuckles" |
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Servo
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 3 on 8/15/2004 1:49 AM >
| | | | Yeah, someone else tried to make up a list like this a while back, with different "types" of explorers. But it makes more sense to classify reasons for exploring, since often people have multiple reasons. Plus, your list is more comprehensive.
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meganb
 
Location: Indiana
Gender: Female
| |  | | | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 4 on 8/15/2004 2:43 AM >
| | | | Great post! I think that it pretty much covers everything.
I'd say that I started UE because I wanted to push myself into doing something that I wouldn't normally do. I wanted to overcome fears, rational or irrational. (Can't say that I've overcome those fears, though.)
I also have always wanted to see the types of places that I have explored and continue to explore...and, perhaps, break the rules a bit. (That tiny little devil of rebelliousness on my shoulder.)
I would guess that nowadays it really appeals to the artistic side of me. I like to make movies, animations and images from the photographs I take. I also like to research and write about the places. To me, now, I think it's something that stirs my creative juices.
Thanks again for the post!
~M
Happiness is the only good.
The time to be happy is now.
The place to be happy is here. The way to be happy is to make others so. -Robert Ingersoll |
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Flagg
Location: Welland, Ontario, Canada
Gender: Male
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 5 on 8/15/2004 4:06 AM >
| | | | I explore because it is in my nature.
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DjMalign
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Gender: Male
Sexy, sexy, sexy
| | | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 6 on 8/15/2004 4:14 AM >
|  | | | Great post mat. As for me, UE encompasses a lot of my life. From an art perspective I use UE in my photography and video art. I also go for the human interest and I also like to study the aesthetics of decay. Within that study of how things pass, change and fade through time I try to find a deeper meaning in life and exploring places that have a history to them I learn a little bit more.
I hate all of you |
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PAexplorations
Location: Pennsylvania
Gender: Female
Medication Time...
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 7 on 8/15/2004 4:26 AM >
| | | | me myself i think i got into it because i like to take pics, and the history part of it, that and i have met alot of great people.........
Your hand is staining my window. |
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Stalker
Location: Hamilton
Your Resident Red Commie Bastard
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 8 on 8/15/2004 3:50 PM >
| | | | 1
2
3
5
6
7
8
All those. )
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Tupsumato
Location: Finland
Gender: Male
How close can you go?
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 9 on 8/15/2004 4:42 PM >
| | | | I explore because... err... well, I like to see how nature conquers abandoned human creations. That's why I prefer old, long-abandoned, almost ruined buildings (like this (please visit gently; it's on my friend's server ;)) instead of new, almost clinically clean places (like this). I also like photographing such places for my own joy and to show them for others.
From MatC's list I'd say 1, 2, 5 and 6.
[last edit 8/15/2004 4:52 PM by Tupsumato - edited 3 times]
All information and details given in good faith but not guaranteed! |
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M @ San Diego
Gender: Male
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 10 on 8/15/2004 6:04 PM >
| | | | I like your "types of explorers" list idea. We can also list some relationships between them (e.g., "The Photographer is natural enemies with Vandal and Tagger, and friends with Historical Explorer."). I guess I'm thinking of something like Flame Warriors here.
If we really wanted to get into it, we could even work in Enneagrams somehow.
[last edit 8/15/2004 6:04 PM by M @ San Diego - edited 1 times]
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M @ San Diego
Gender: Male
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 11 on 8/15/2004 6:14 PM >
| | | | One of the main things that attracts me to UE is seeking knowledge; discovering how things work behind the scenes, and being in places that most people aren't aware of. College tunneling and draining probably draw a lot of people like this.
I didn't see this on the list, although it might be a subcategory of "transgression".
[last edit 8/15/2004 6:20 PM by M @ San Diego - edited 1 times]
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GotPaisley!
Location: Lost.
Gender: Female
Exploring Gypsy!
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 12 on 8/15/2004 7:52 PM >
| | | | Okay... For me it is 1,2,5,6,7 but not neccessarily in that order.
I have always explored abandoned places ever since I was in my early teens. We would sneak into old houses, schools, & buildings. I always thought I would outgrow it. That hasn't happened. I remember skipping high school so we could go explore the Newton Ransom Convelasant Home near where I grew up. Also, driving down old scary roads looking for something I guess was never really there. I just never thought of taking pictures. As far as history & background of places I have to thank my family. They were always taking me the library, historical society, or some place of interest or history then quiz what I learned later. So, I guess now the two come hand in hand.
We recently went to canada for the week & we took my fiance & his kids to Boldt Castle. I rememeber when it was nothing but an old abandoned castle that we went to in the 70's. It was all tagged up & gave you an eerie feeling. Now they are restoring the castle & it is beautiful but I still long for the unkept, damage from the elements & forgotten ghostly feelings it had at one time. Also, we drove by a place by my grams old fishing cottage that we would call the "witch house" ... I rememeber snaeking in there when i was 11. No one lived there but when we snuck in it was a instant rush. It is still there but it has now since been remodeled. I still get the same feeling as when I was kid when i explore today.
Now when we go places to explore I take pictures....
Oh well, Who ever said we had to grow up! lol
Have a paisley day!!!
~pais
[last edit 8/15/2004 7:57 PM by GotPaisley! - edited 2 times]
There must be quite a few things a hot bath won't cure, but I don't know any of them.
~Sylvia Plath, The Bell Jar
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MatC
Nobler Donor
Location: ENY
Gender: Male
Accepted everywhere
| | | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 13 on 8/15/2004 8:17 PM >
| | | | Posted by M @ San Diego
We can also list some relationships between them (e.g., "The Photographer is natural enemies with Vandal and Tagger, and friends with Historical Explorer.")
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Well, the only problem with this (as can be demonstrated by the previous few posts) is that most people explore for a lot of different reasons. Servo hit this point on the head, too, since even people who primarily explore certain things cannot accurately be described as just a "drainer" or a "roofer" or whatever, because that's not ALL that you do. I suppose these terms could be used in the negative (if you never explore drains, then you could say with certainty, "I am not a drainer") but positive description may not be possible with these terms, unless they're combined, "I am a drainer, and a speleologist, and a..." But at that point, you might as well just say, "I am an explorer," and be done with it.
Posted by M @ San Diego
One of the main things that attracts me to UE is seeking knowledge; discovering how things work behind the scenes, and being in places that most people aren't aware of. College tunneling and draining probably draw a lot of people like this.
I didn't see this on the list, although it might be a subcategory of "transgression".
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Good point. I realized partway through that my list doesn't really cover live infiltrations very well (partially because I don't do those as much as abandonments), although some of the points do apply to it. But this would be a good addition to the list -- people who explore something that's working seeking knowledge. I suppose it could go under #8, since it has to do with curiosity, but... well, I'll think about it.
-- Mat
"We shall not cease from exploration / And the end of all our exploring / Will be to arrive where we started / And know the place for the first time."
- T.S. Eliot, excerpt from "Little Gidding" |
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M @ San Diego
Gender: Male
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 14 on 8/16/2004 5:33 AM >
| | | | Posted by MatC
But this would be a good addition to the list -- people who explore something that's working seeking knowledge. I suppose it could go under #8, since it has to do with curiosity, but... well, I'll think about it.
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Now that I think about it, it would go under #8. I just didn't relate to it at first because it seemed to downplay the passion of the curious explorer (unintentional on your part, I know). Like many UE'ers, some of the best experiences of my life have come from discovery; I wouldn't describe it as just "something to do", although it may be technically correct.
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Samurai
Vehicular Lord Rick
Location: northeastern New York
No matter where you go, there you are...
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 15 on 8/16/2004 4:55 PM >
| | | | Posted by Servo
Yeah, someone else tried to make up a list like this a while back, with different "types" of explorers. But it makes more sense to classify reasons for exploring, since often people have multiple reasons. Plus, your list is more comprehensive.
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Reason why people explore and types of explorers are two different things... My list was meant in jest, just something that I had thought about on particularly crappy day. 
Historical value is paramount. In almost of these places we talk about or have posted in the DB, time has happened there. Events went on, people spent time in them. To most other people, most of these places are unremarkable eyesores in the landscape they take for granted every day. To us, if I may be so bold, there is more to it.
This has resurfaced more and more as the summer has wore on. Interesting.
Samurai
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Ninjalicious
Gone, but always with us
Location: Toronto
| | | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 16 on 8/16/2004 5:08 PM >
| | | | The list prompts some interesting self examination, but I don't think assigning numbers to vague, often subconscious, motivations works very well.
Personally, I think I explore for fun, adventure, perspective, challenge, excitement, exercise, reasons of aesthetic appreciation, and probably dozens of other reasons. While doing it, I get a kick out of historical features, interesting architecture and infrastructure, complexity, human interaction and many other elements. I'd like to flatter myself into thinking that what entices me can't be boiled down into something as simple as a list of eight possible motivations.
Incidentally, Agent K recently made an interesting post about the motivations of explorers on the Usufruct blog at http://infiltration.org/usufruct/archives/000212.html .
Ninj
http://www.infiltration.org
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Kimmo
Noble Donor
| | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 17 on 8/16/2004 5:24 PM >
| | | | I consider myself more of a history freak than anything else. I document by photographing and I prefer to search and look historical places and buildings...that's all.
If I could find another definition for that than UE, I would use it.
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IIVQ
Location: La Sud-Est du cité majeur du North-Holland (Bijlmer), .NL
Gender: Male
Back in Urbex!
| |  |  | | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 18 on 8/16/2004 5:57 PM >
| | | | My reasons
(and I quote myself from a tv show about UE.)
-"That's 8 times 2.5 metres so about 20 metres. They are going to climb it and they want me to do it as well. I don't know whether I dare to go so high, but they think I do dare."
-"Wow *pfwew* Scary, but worth the view .... And the kick, that's one of my reasons as well"
-"This is an old factory they're demolishing but they're doing that for a year and a half now, we're just going in and have a look at what's still standing."
-"The buildings have something which you can't really catch in a photograph. A bit, but it's the Being There which makes it worth it for me. / It's indeed some sort of castles, some people like old castles ,me too, but this is beautiful as well ... it has atmosphere!"
-"Something new can be beautiful but you can see in a factory that it has been running for 30, 40, 50 years or a building which is completely worn out, and usually you can still see the traces of what has happened there, old stuff, magazines, schematics which are still there..."
Tijmen
Posted by MapMan | 18/9/2005 19:25 | Hedy Lamarr made porn?
Posted by turbozutek | 20/9/2005 2:29 | Dude, educate us! |
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MatC
Nobler Donor
Location: ENY
Gender: Male
Accepted everywhere
| | | Re: Reasons for UE (beware - long post)
<Reply # 19 on 8/16/2004 6:44 PM >
| | | | Posted by Ninjalicious
The list prompts some interesting self examination, but I don't think assigning numbers to vague, often subconscious, motivations works very well.
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I agree, which is why I generally tried to arrange the list so that it spoke to larger motivations rather than attempting to represent a unique motivation with a number (i.e. -- "ExplorerBob? He's a 43(b) and a 74, while I'm more of a 23(c)-(f)"). The numbers themselves were intended more as a useful list-organization tool than an attempt to strictly categorize. This is because, as anyone who has attempted any sort of psychological self-evaluation, it's just about impossible to try to nail down exactly why we do anything, especially a behavior as complex as UE.
However, while it's impossible to nail it down exactly, I felt that I wanted to try to attack the issue because UE'ing is quite different from the other activities I enjoy doing, and so I wanted to try to investigate the reasons for it as far as possible (which is why I am glad it did prompt some "interesting self examination" for you). I have fudged a little bit in terms of general categories such as "Darker Motives," since (as we all know) there have been entire threads about whether it *is* a darker motive, for example, to take a sheet of stationery from a pile of a hundred sheets, or if that's merely the UE equivalent of taking a souvenir rock from the Grand Canyon... or if it doesn't become a darker motive until one takes something larger, or more unqiue, or whatever. That is one reason I mentioned that the list is not intended to be exhaustive -- it simply cannot be.
Posted by Ninjalicious
I'd like to flatter myself into thinking that what entices me can't be boiled down into something as simple as a list of eight possible motivations.
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And I wasn't trying to say that it can. I engage in self-reflection a lot of the time, giving thought to the things that I do and the reasons I enjoy doing them. The list that I posted was part of my attempt to do this for UE, and my attempt to broaden my personal experience to what I think that others experience in a similar situation. The eight motivations that I posted cover a wide variety of actual internal motivations, but they certainly do not cover everything. However, I don't think that renders valueless the attempt to do.
So, in essence, I took a shotgun approach to defining why I (and maybe others) UE. I hit some points and missed others, but I think that what is important (for me, at least, if not for others) is making an honest attempt to define. Some people may be uncomfortable with an attempt to define which, by definition (ha ha), is doomed to be incomplete. But, for me, it is a necessary step on the way to understanding.
As for Agent K's blog entry, it's interesting because it is another topic that I've given some thought to (what activities the definition of UE encompasses and what it does not) and it serves to make a good point -- that things can be both more and less than they appear. Is someone who wanders accidentally into an off-limits area doing UE? What about a person who goes there for the purpose of exploration? What about the electrician who works there? All three people have done the same thing and been in the same place -- are they all urban explorers? What about someone who sneaks into an area that they think is off-limits, but instead is open to the public? Have they engaged in UE simply because they think they have, or are they just deluding themselves?
I think questions like these aid us in demonstrating that things are often much more complicated than we expect them to be and that definitions are slippery things. Some people like that, and some people don't. Some people seek definitions for things despite their inherent limitations, and some people eschew them because of those same drawbacks. It all depends on who you are and what psychological requirements you're seeking to fill.
Or maybe I am just making this all up. :-p
-- Mat
"We shall not cease from exploration / And the end of all our exploring / Will be to arrive where we started / And know the place for the first time."
- T.S. Eliot, excerpt from "Little Gidding" |
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